NFL Preseasont talk

[Lyion]

We need to tangent this tread on to Whale Wars, and the inept hippies trying to be pirates there. I just started watching this as Animal Planet has it on all the time.

I think Vick needs to go fight the japanese and save the whales to prove his remorse.

[Harrison]

I lol'd at the imagery of Michael Vick on the bow of a ship with a cutlass shouting orders at a crew of dirty fag-ass hippies trying to ram Japanese whaling ships.

[Tikker]

back to the real topic

Pittsburgh will win it all again~


NE is going to be tough, and no one in the NFC really competes with the top tier AFC teams yet again (altho the bears might be tough if the defense stays healthy)

[Haylo]

Look I love dogs, but come on the guy is not the first felon to grace the field and he sure as hell wont be the last. Let's be real; the NFL has a long history of being filled with players who are not the role models they would have us believe. If you want to boycott the NFL because of Vick, you shouldn't have been watching all this time. What about all of the other criminals err players who have done deplorable things with their wits fully in hand. A quick google search produces:

21 percent of NFL players -- more than one in five -- have been charged with at least one serious crime, including two murder arrests, seven rape charges, 45 counts of domestic violence and 42 charges of assault and battery.

Michael Irvin - How much Cocaine does one man have to do/get caught with before enough is enough?

Mark Chmura - Nothing like going after the 17yr old babysitter of your children at her prom!

Lawrence Taylor - Crack head extraordinaire who actually described his own home as a "crackhouse"

Bill Romanowski - Racist mfer who thinks spitting in the face of his opponents is A-Ok! Not to mention his violence toward those same opponents, has anyone been fined more than this guy?

Mark Gastineau - Assault, drug possession, woman beating, woman burning and steriods. Stellar guy.

Sebastian Janikowski - He's been arrested for bar fights, drinking and driving (.20 BAC), reckless driving, bribing a police officer, evidence tampering and possession of a drug best known in the media as "the date rape drug.

Atlanta Falcons defensive back Patrick Bates was charged with assaulting his pregnant girlfriend and, three weeks after the baby was born, kidnapping the child and beating the mother with a gun. Bates finally was let go by the Falcons, pleaded guilty to reduced charges and was signed by the Oakland Raiders.

Falcons all-pro linebacker Cornelius Bennett was charged with rape, sodomy, sexual abuse and unlawful imprisonment. Bennett pleaded guilty to sexual misconduct and was sentenced to 60 days in jail. He was neither released by the Falcons nor fined by the NFL.

Former Rams and Miami Dolphins running back Lawrence Phillips repeatedly was arrested for assault and motor-vehicle violations. Rams assistant coach Johnny Roland minimized Phillips' conduct this way: "Everyone deserves a second chance -- sometimes a third or fourth chance. He didn't kill anyone."

There's more but it's too depressing. The point is that if you like the game, watch the game. If you are trying to find a reason not to support any sport, it's not going to take much digging to find the dirt. Probably only golf will net you a virtually clean slate for most of their athletes.

As far as sales dropping, Reebok has had to reprint Vick's eagles jersey I believe 3 times already because of the demand.

[Drem]

lol nice

thank you haylo

[Gypsiyee]

lots of perfectly viable stuff

Like I said, it's not just because of Vick - this stuff just further backs up why I'm so disgusted. course, it's not to say the NBA is much better - there's plenty of rap sheets there, too. There are a few up there that I definitely think are comparable to Vick's crimes - I wouldn't even remotely put drug abuse in the same category, though, and I don't think Stallworth is comparable either. That's not to say that I think one crime is better than the other - in a perfect world, none of these dipshits would make more than minimum wage cleaning up shit from port-o-potties.

I'm not going to pretend I knew about all of these cases because I didn't - had I, I would've had the same reaction. I'm human - there's a whole mess of players to follow, and if it isn't highly covered, I don't independently research each player to look up what they've done. Obviously, Vick's was bigger news because he has a bigger name. Different issues hit different people on different levels - this one hits close to home, so it's my personal breaking point.

I guess my point is that the Vick thing was so publicized and so cruel that perhaps it really brings to light how ludicrous it is that these people are invited back to be portrayed as heroes. If anything, I would hope that a case of brutality as high profile as Vick's would've been all the reason for the NFL to finally man up, put its foot down and say that this shit is unacceptable and we're not just going to let them get away with it anymore. I realize that there are cruel people in every profession, especially high paid professions - my problem is how much attention needs to be drawn to it before someone does something about it and finally says no more. The only way to get that point across is if people get angry enough to say it. The only way it's ever going to change is if it becomes less profitable for them to continue to do it. I may be one person with a tiny voice, but I'm pissed off enough to say I've had it - that's my choice, not my loss, and that's okay. I'm certainly not the only one who feels that way.

Grats to Reebok having to print more jerseys, but for every additional jersey they print you still have someone out there who's going the opposite route and they're losing a sale from - there's two sides to that coin, just like anything else.

and Drem, there's nothing "lol" about any of it, but go ahead and pat yourself on the back in some sort of in your face victory that there's other assholes out there aside from Vick (surprise...?). Not really sure how that's remotely entertaining, but glad you got a laugh.

[vonkaar]

"these people are invited back to be portrayed as heroes."

[Gypsiyee]

if you're saying idolization and heroism isn't a factor in major league sports, I'm going to have to respectfully disagree.

[Drem]

Grats to Reebok having to print more jerseys, but for every additional jersey they print you still have someone out there who's going the opposite route and they're losing a sale from - there's two sides to that coin, just like anything else.

um, no. there are just a few of you going "the opposite route". nobody cares as much as you. which is why i'm getting a laugh, despite whatever you assume and feel like writing another short story about after you read this blurb.

and whatever else you'd like to assume i'm doing, such as patting myself on the back for "some sort of in your face victory", whatever you're talking about there. maybe you should try for just one day to take things less personally. it'll do you a lot of good

[Gypsiyee]

I'll take a pass on the constant life lessons and memoirs from an angsty 22 year old that you like to so often dish out, thanks. I like caring about things.

apparently you know everyone in the united states enough to know that no one cares as much as I do. you must be some important person.

[Jay]

lots of perfectly viable stuff

Like I said, it's not just because of Vick - this stuff just further backs up why I'm so disgusted. course, it's not to say the NBA is much better - there's plenty of rap sheets there, too. There are a few up there that I definitely think are comparable to Vick's crimes - I wouldn't even remotely put drug abuse in the same category, though, and I don't think Stallworth is comparable either. That's not to say that I think one crime is better than the other - in a perfect world, none of these dipshits would make more than minimum wage cleaning up shit from port-o-potties.

I'm not going to pretend I knew about all of these cases because I didn't - had I, I would've had the same reaction. I'm human - there's a whole mess of players to follow, and if it isn't highly covered, I don't independently research each player to look up what they've done. Obviously, Vick's was bigger news because he has a bigger name. Different issues hit different people on different levels - this one hits close to home, so it's my personal breaking point.

I guess my point is that the Vick thing was so publicized and so cruel that perhaps it really brings to light how ludicrous it is that these people are invited back to be portrayed as heroes. If anything, I would hope that a case of brutality as high profile as Vick's would've been all the reason for the NFL to finally man up, put its foot down and say that this shit is unacceptable and we're not just going to let them get away with it anymore. I realize that there are cruel people in every profession, especially high paid professions - my problem is how much attention needs to be drawn to it before someone does something about it and finally says no more. The only way to get that point across is if people get angry enough to say it. The only way it's ever going to change is if it becomes less profitable for them to continue to do it. I may be one person with a tiny voice, but I'm pissed off enough to say I've had it - that's my choice, not my loss, and that's okay. I'm certainly not the only one who feels that way.

Grats to Reebok having to print more jerseys, but for every additional jersey they print you still have someone out there who's going the opposite route and they're losing a sale from - there's two sides to that coin, just like anything else.

and Drem, there's nothing "lol" about any of it, but go ahead and pat yourself on the back in some sort of in your face victory that there's other assholes out there aside from Vick (surprise...?). Not really sure how that's remotely entertaining, but glad you got a laugh.

I understand that the Vick thing hits home and that it's disappointing to you that he's again a member of the NFL, but how much punishment do you want him to receive? He spent 2 years in jail and lost 135 million dollars. Now, I'm never gonna like the guy ever again, but I don't think there's a problem with him playing football. Just makes me kinda sad to see that you'd boycott such an amazing sport over Michael Vick. It's also kind of disappointing to me that none of the NFL's players who ARE role models and charitible people who genuinely help the less fortunate will get any of your support because their positive efforts don't hit home enough for you to remain a fan.

[Reynaldo]

I hate Crabtree alot more than Vick right now. At least Vick is playing for a (relatively) low salary to try and make things right instead of holding a team hostage for an unrealistic contract.

F Rookies!

[Drem]

I'll take a pass on the constant life lessons and memoirs from an angsty 22 year old that you like to so often dish out, thanks. I like caring about things.

apparently you know everyone in the united states enough to know that no one cares as much as I do. you must be some important person.

uh, who's angsty? i'm not the one crying about michael vick. and yes i am omniscient and i know everything lolwtf. where do you come up with this shit? just look around. NO ONE CARES. they're reprinting his jersey and they're making money and he's playing football again. end of story. of course people are goign to be against it. i don't think there's anything in the entire world that everyone appreciates or is a fan of, except maybe water and air and my fiancee hates drinking water and swimming so that might not even be true

get real. stop trying to ruin my day because someone doesn't agree with you

and i'm not 22

[Tikker]

I hate Crabtree alot more than Vick right now. At least Vick is playing for a (relatively) low salary to try and make things right instead of holding a team hostage for an unrealistic contract.

F Rookies!

NFL needs to adapt rookie salary caps

[Lyion]

Like it or not the NFL is a PR entertainment league, and the Commish has tried to change the image of the league. Obviously he's failing.

Should Vick be forgiven and has he paid his due. Sure.

Should be be in the NFL? Nope.

I'm sorry but my opinion is he's fucked up his chances and should not be in a family based sport making millions of dollars now. How many of you would get your jobs back out of prison, in a far less demanding and media scrutinized field?

I have a lot more empathy for a bored 22 year old who rolls a joint, then I do for someone hooking up car batteries to defenesless kenneled dogs and shocking them to death, or watching them struggle and drown.

I realize he was in a minimum security prison and cried and did his 18 months, but when I see him on TV, everything he says rings hollow and strikes me as Lawyer PR inspired bullshit. The dude knew the jig was up and could've stopped this at any time. He lied and lied about it to Arthur Blank, the NFL, the media, and everyone up until he was caught.

Any comparison is a simple red herring. Kick all the dirtbags out, if you like. This discussion is only about Vick.

Now he's walking out with his nice shiny new millions, with such a great lesson. It doesn't matter what you do or how barbaric you act, as long as you can run like the wind there's a spot for you in the NFL.

p.s. A rookie salary cap is waaay overdue. The amount paid to rookies is obscene and the NFLPA should wise up and support all the players, not just the cocksucker agents.

[Gypsiyee]

I cut myself to feel aliiiiiiiive!

Plenty of people care - just because you don't know them personally doesn't mean that they don't exist. I have a different perspective than Haylo and Jay, but they both have valid points worth rationally discussing. Sorry if my posts are too lengthy for you or if my opinion bothers you, but the whole purpose of an discussion forum is to.. you know, discuss things.

Jay, it's perfectly respectable what those players do. There's no denying that there are several honorable charitable people in the NFL who do outweigh the bad - I'm not discrediting the actions of those guys in any sense, nor do I respect them any less.

However, I do personally subscribe to the theory that you're only as strong as your weakest link in any organization. The bad may not outweigh the good, but a couple drops of shit do contaminate the entire glass of water. Getting 1.6 million again isn't punishment for ripping the teeth out of dogs, strapping them into rape racks to overbreed them, hooking them up to car batteries, throwing them into pools and letting them bloody their paws trying to escape in pain - we're not just talking about once or twice or even a handful of times. Bad Newz Kennels ran for who knows how long - 5+ years that I know of. There are plenty of felons with far less severe crimes who f up at 18 and actually reform themselves in prison who have to pound the pavement and get rejected from one minimum wage job after another. Hell, in this economy there have been people laid off longer than Vick served.. a year and a half isn't a whole lot of time - essentially, his sentence was to be bored and follow some military-light rules for 18 months, lose some money, and come back later - ouch...? On paper he may have gone broke but I think it'd be foolish to believe that he didn't have plenty in little hidey holes.

I'm not out there picketting against Vick like a lot of folks are, nor am I trying to convince anyone else to feel the way I do - this is my personal feeling on it, and I'm not disappointed by it.

[Reynaldo]

Now he's walking out with his nice shiny new millions, with such a great lesson. It doesn't matter what you do or how barbaric you act, as long as you can run like the wind there's a spot for you in the NFL.

Not to nitpick but Usane Bolt (sp?) was tried out for NFL teams and didn't make it!!!!

My personal take on it is that the NFL is there to provide me entertainment. I love my chiefs and hate the raiders/broncos, but when they're not playing I want to see entertaining games. With players like Vick, and now Favre again...my entertainment value ramps up. So in week 7, when the Eagles are playing some other NFC team I could care less about, I'll tune in on my Sunday Ticket just to see what Vick does or how they use him instead of not caring.

[Harrison]

Who gives a fuck what someone did? It's a job. They aren't fucking watching your kids or some shit.

I've seen rapists get less hate than Michael Vick. It's disgusting.

[Drem]

and Drem, there's nothing "lol" about any of it, but go ahead and pat yourself on the back in some sort of in your face victory that there's other assholes out there aside from Vick (surprise...?). Not really sure how that's remotely entertaining, but glad you got a laugh.

Hey I actually asked you a question. Where do you come up with this shit? How does me saying "lol wow, nice post Haylo" at the wealth of information she posted (most of it was pretty new to me) translate to me patting myself on the back at some sort of victory?

Do you read my first posts in this thread and somehow think I'm pro-felons-in-the-NFL? Because I'm not. But I'm also realistic and know it's unavoidable. I actually deleted a different response and wrote this because I just now realize the mistake you've made and how terribly you've misinterpreted me. Should I link you to the definition of what it means to be a cynic?

and for the record, since you think my saying "no one cares" means literally no one in the entire physical world, you should look at it realistically. who could that statement fit? well, the people in the NFL that decide whether or not he gets signed again.... and, like i said, apparently no one (important) cares

[Gypsiyee]

I think it's the tone your posts come off in. You didn't say "wow, nice post haylo" you said "lol nice, thank you haylo." that to me comes off as "haha, you got ownt", especially when in comparison to the tone in your previous posts in the thread, like the one starting with "big whoop." it's the internet, man - the only way you can interpret someone is through their verbiage.

when you say something like no one cares, I assume that to mean no fans, which is simply untrue. I'd also challenge the logic behind saying no one important cares, because I think the fan base is just as (if not more) important as the guys upstairs. the suits don't care. that's obvious, and that's one of the reasons I'm so disgusted. there are plenty of fans that do, however, and those are the people I'm referring to.

[Reynaldo]

Looks like Arlos and Lyion both did pretty well. 2-4 in the NFC, and 3-4 in the AFC.

Don't know if you were lucky or smart on that Cincy pick though...they look like they're falling apart here late.

I'm rooting for the saints/colts superbowl if they both stay undefeated to shut up those stupid dolphins. I wouldn't mind LT getting a ring but I just hate Rivers too bad to root for them.

Would love to see the Saints or Vikings win. I can't really get behind anyone in the AFC that's going to make it this year.

[Tikker]

I'm rooting for the saints/colts superbowl if they both stay undefeated to shut up those stupid dolphins.

Amen

especially that fucking mercury morris

[Diekan]

Apparently... killing a dog is WAY worse than killing a human.

Actually, yes. Fuck humans. The human species is nothing more than a viral infection on planet Earth. Like a virus, the human animal replicates out of control, destroys vital systems and has no conscious.

[brinstar]

okay agent smith

[Reynaldo]

Sounds like Diekan saw Avatar this weekend =P.