namelesstavern.net

by **brinstar** » Thu Mar 18, 2004 2:07 am

mindia someday you will learn how to have a discussion. this thing you're doing now is not discussing. you're responding to points with barely related tangential counterpoints, failing to remain objective, citing questionable sources (the Holy Trinity Web Ring lol), and perhaps worst of all, refusing to entertain the possibility that you are doing any of these things. you're probably going to assume that i'm not taking your side because i don't like you, but that's not true.

you claim faith as your reasoning for your beliefs, and that's fine-- but then you come out swinging with all these facts. if pressed to define the word faith i would phrase it as "belief in something without factual basis". if you're going to play the faith card, have the common sense to tap out of the logic ring, because faith and logic are almost always contradictory.

summary: you're never going to reach anyone if you keep using this condescending and accusatory tone and keep trying to argue faith with facts.

if you're still reading, i now give you permission to fully write me off as another hellbound hedonist and take nothing i've thoughtfully discoursed upon to heart

edit: hello page 5

by **Muglack** » Thu Mar 18, 2004 2:29 am

Once again it has become abundantly clear that Mindia will NOT answer my questions, or respond at all to my posts. This has been an ongoing trait with him for as long as I have been posting. I pose a question to him, he knows that there is no way he can give a plausible answer without proving himself wrong, so he completely skips over it. The thing about Mindia that you people need to understand is that he's only 70% sure he's right. You're feeding that 70% with things he "knows" the answers too. I on the other hand address the other 30%. The 30% of his psyche that's pretty sure he's wrong. The 30% that isn't completely brainwashed and likely to respond with whatever propaganda has been force fed to him.

But I digress. I'm gonna ask a really serious question and I would appreciate it if noone else posted until Mindia answered because it will really help prove a point.

Mindia. You talk often about your girlfriend, and you seem to be very happy. My question, although fairly personal is a simple yes/no question, so it shouldn't be that big of a deal. Do you and your girlfriend engage in premarital "activites" (and I don't mean floorhockey)?

by **Drunnken** » Thu Mar 18, 2004 2:36 am

your arrogance is as annoying as mindia's ignorance

by **Narrock** » Thu Mar 18, 2004 2:38 am

The problem I have with some of you is that you toedance around the "point" and don't address the issue at hand. You're too busy pointing out my comprehension ability, my alleged mixing of fact and faith, my lack of knowledge, my sins, my Christianity, etc.

Read the mormon doctrine. You cannot call them "Christians" with beliefs like that! What more proof do you need? Why are your skulls so thick? Are you all just playing a big joke on me? I am truly baffled by what's going on here.

Put all the BS aside for a change so we can have a logical discussion, and if necessary, debate.

I have already proven that Catholics teach against what the Bible teaches. Never mind for a moment that you think the Bible is wrong because it was written by several people. I've already proven, through the LDS'sown doctrine that they, cannot be considered "Christians" by Biblical definition.

What more proof do you need? This is absolutely bizarre to me. And pointing out the source of my post on the Trinity is also superficial. Anybody could have written that. Look at passages that they present as proof and cross-reference it yourself in the Bible. It's there.

by **Muglack** » Thu Mar 18, 2004 2:38 am

Why don't you go and start another thread about how cool you and all your friends are for smoking pot, and leave this discussion for the people with more then a handful of braincells. Put down your bong and pick up a book, then maybe you can actually contribute to a conversation in a productive manner.

by **Narrock** » Thu Mar 18, 2004 2:45 am

Muglack wrote:Once again it has become abundantly clear that Mindia will NOT answer my questions, or respond at all to my posts. This has been an ongoing trait with him for as long as I have been posting. I pose a question to him, he knows that there is no way he can give a plausible answer without proving himself wrong, so he completely skips over it. The thing about Mindia that you people need to understand is that he's only 70% sure he's right. You're feeding that 70% with things he "knows" the answers too. I on the other hand address the other 30%. The 30% of his psyche that's pretty sure he's wrong. The 30% that isn't completely brainwashed and likely to respond with whatever propaganda has been force fed to him.

But I digress. I'm gonna ask a really serious question and I would appreciate it if noone else posted until Mindia answered because it will really help prove a point.

Mindia. You talk often about your girlfriend, and you seem to be very happy. My question, although fairly personal is a simple yes/no question, so it shouldn't be that big of a deal. Do you and your girlfriend engage in premarital "activites" (and I don't mean floorhockey)?

Nice try Muglack. I'm never again going to get into my personal love life here on the board. You're way too transparent and predictable. If I answered "yes" then you would immediately say something along the lines of "So you call yourself a Christian?" or "what a hypocrite" etc. If I say "No" then you would call me a liar or a pansy.

by **brinstar** » Thu Mar 18, 2004 2:47 am

hey come on it couldn't be as bad as that time you met some internet chick in a hotel room and then couldn't fuck her because she had shitballs on her ass

by **Muglack** » Thu Mar 18, 2004 2:50 am

Actually I asked my question because you stated that you lived your life by the good book, and you knew you made mistakes but you asked for absolution for them. It was not attempt to attack your personal life, I was just wondering if you and your girlfriend, who are obviously devout worshippers willfully, and knowingly engaged in an activity which is clearly against the book you place on so high a pedestal.

I mean I could of brought up your late night rendez-vous with the human turd factory, but people change, and the past is just that, the past.

by **vonkaar** » Thu Mar 18, 2004 7:45 am

brinstar wrote:mindia someday you will learn how to have a discussion. this thing you're doing now is not discussing. you're responding to points with barely related tangential counterpoints, failing to remain objective, citing questionable sources (the Holy Trinity Web Ring lol)

MINDIA: STOP FOCUSING ON ANOTHER RELIGION AND STICK TO THE GOD DAMNED FUCKING POINT.

How hard is this? I'm going to give up... I've often wondered why so many people burn out trying to argue with you. Have you 'won' an argument in the history of NT? This is like debating with a retarded parrot.

Vonkaar, you obviously don't know anything about Momons... so here is a copy and pasted article from a random google search. This proves my entire point because the Mormons are evil. I know that you never actually said that the Mormons are righteous people, only that they should enjoy the same freedom of "Faith in the unseen" that I enjoy, but I like spreading hate-propaganda on the web. The whole point of this conversation has shifted from the validity of the NIV and my constant misrepresentation of a good Christian and is now focused primarily on the Evil Mormon Empire. By the way, Brigham Young had sex with boys."

Try... I mean... TRY to answer... make an attempt at rebutting the 200 unanswered questions that I (and others) have asked. Stop 'responding' with links and copied debates... that's weak. Make SOME sort of effort here... otherwise, I'm done. I have *never* been more frustrated with a 'rant' in my life. My ten-year-old niece would follow the logic in this post better than you :?. At least Leadaira stuck to her guns... kept on with the same insipid responses... you can't even keep to a single train of thought. For seriouslinessity.... I'm going to read a few more responses and if things don't improve, I'm done with this thread.

Cliff notes of unanswered questions. Answer these, or I'm done.

1. Why do you feel comfotable with judging other people for their religious practices? Judging isn't for you to do. Condemning, isn't for you to do. You are the only person here on the assumed "Christian" side, but you are looking worse than many of the evil Anti-Christs of the thread. I *know* the life I lead. I don't know anything about you... or ANY SINGLE member of the 7th-day sect. Even if I did, by the Christian Bible, I am UNABLE to judge them. Why is this so easy for you?

2. What Bible should I read? You say the NIV is alright. Could I read from the Catholic Bible? What about the Korran? What about the Mormon Holy Bible?

3. There are at least 10 questions that an Atheist could ask you that you would be unable to answer with anything besides, "Faith." Faith is the entire foundation that EVERY religion is based on. If "faith" is an alright response to those questions, why can't the Mormons base their ENTIRE RELIGION on Faith? Why is it alright for you to believe in God and worship however you want to, but the Mormons aren't allowed this luxury?

That's it. Quick responses, or I'm done. That's a threat! I don't want to wade through 2 pages of plagiarized dialogue, I want Mindia's answers. Why is judging so easy? What Bible should I read? Why is Faith good enough for you, but not good enough for the Jehova's Witnesses? Go.

by **brinstar** » Thu Mar 18, 2004 8:09 am

1. judging is easy because it makes me feel stronger in my own faith, just like trashing other peoples' lifestyles makes me feel better about my own

2. you should read the bible Pastor Bob tells us to read because he has a minivan and gets paid by tithes which if you weren't an idiot you'd know means 10% of your income

3. because mormons are just wrong

those are FACTS

by **vonkaar** » Thu Mar 18, 2004 8:31 am

Oh yeah, that reminds me...

Question number 4.

Why do you say that it is Biblical for churches to demand tithing. Do you realize that the "Tithing" commandment came with the same set of rules that said that clothing with more than one fabric is forbidden, or that menstruating women were unclean and defiled everything that they happened to touh? Why is it that of all the strange commandments in Numbers, Leviticus and Deuteronomy, the ministers decided to keep the part about giving them money? Why not keep the rule about shellfish being an abomination? Obviously the fishing industry bribed them.

by **brinstar** » Thu Mar 18, 2004 8:44 am

VONKAAR WHY CAN'T YOU FACE THE FACTS I GAVE YOU FACTS AND YOU STILL WON'T LISTEN FACTS FACTS FACTASF ASDAFDFAS

by **Tossica** » Thu Mar 18, 2004 12:06 pm

by **liquidstayce** » Thu Mar 18, 2004 1:10 pm

rofl.. evil

Metranon Metranome · by **Metranon** » Thu Mar 18, 2004 2:56 pm

[GOD SHUT THE FUCK UP ALREADY

fine, we're all going to hell and mormons christians and everyone on this board are sinners, just shut up and stop posting your stupid fucking drivel

by **Kaeerwen** » Thu Mar 18, 2004 2:58 pm

hehe [

edit: Nevermind...

by **Drunnken** » Thu Mar 18, 2004 2:59 pm

Vonkaar can you rename this thread to:

"Shoot yourself in the FACE"?

by **Narrock** » Thu Mar 18, 2004 3:52 pm

1. Why do you feel comfotable with judging other people for their religious practices? Judging isn't for you to do. Condemning, isn't for you to do. You are the only person here on the assumed "Christian" side, but you are looking worse than many of the evil Anti-Christs of the thread. I *know* the life I lead. I don't know anything about you... or ANY SINGLE member of the 7th-day sect. Even if I did, by the Christian Bible, I am UNABLE to judge them. Why is this so easy for you?

1. Ok, say your niece gets raped by some guy and they catch him. Are you going to pass judgment on him? HELL YES you would, and don't even try to to say you wouldn't. Are we supposed to be judgmental according to the Bible? No. Do we all judge anyway? YES. In the same manner as YOU would judge the man who raped your niece, I would judge a group of people who dare call themselves Christians yet engage in practices that go directly against what the Bible says. Why is this so easy for me? Because I know Jesus, and I know the Bible, and I know that what the Mormons and Catholics are doing is wrong. I would be willing to stake my life that millions upon millions of Christians around the world would agree with me on that point. ONCE AGAIN... if you knew what was in the Bible, then you would know that what the Catholics and Mormons teach is wrong. That's a fact... not conjecture or opinion.

2. What Bible should I read? You say the NIV is alright. Could I read from the Catholic Bible? What about the Korran? What about the Mormon Holy Bible?

2. I can only tell you that I like the NIV best. There's no such thing as the "Mormon Holy Bible" to the best of my knowledge. The title itself is an oxymoron. The "Book of Mormon", to the LDS church, is held equal to that of the Holy Bible. The Catholic Bible would be a perfect choice for you if you were a Catholic. Here's a list of different versions for you:
http://bessel.org/bibles.htm

3. There are at least 10 questions that an Atheist could ask you that you would be unable to answer with anything besides, "Faith." Faith is the entire foundation that EVERY religion is based on. If "faith" is an alright response to those questions, why can't the Mormons base their ENTIRE RELIGION on Faith? Why is it alright for you to believe in God and worship however you want to, but the Mormons aren't allowed this luxury?

3. Anybody can do whatever they want. Satanic cults have the right to worship satan if they want to. I never said that the Mormon's weren't allowed the luxury of basing their religion on Faith. FOR THE UMPTEENTH TIME... according to their own doctrine and their own practices in their "temples" they cannot, according to Biblical definition, be labeled as true "Christians." Again, yes they have the right to worship as they please and base their entire religion on FAITH. However, they are wrong according to the Bible, and not just MY opinion.

Oh yeah, that reminds me...

Question number 4.

Why do you say that it is Biblical for churches to demand tithing. Do you realize that the "Tithing" commandment came with the same set of rules that said that clothing with more than one fabric is forbidden, or that menstruating women were unclean and defiled everything that they happened to touh? Why is it that of all the strange commandments in Numbers, Leviticus and Deuteronomy, the ministers decided to keep the part about giving them money? Why not keep the rule about shellfish being an abomination? Obviously the fishing industry bribed them.

I've never been to a church that demands Tithe. When they pass that collection plate through the rows they are not demanding that you give. They are giving you the opportunity to give an offering to your Lord. The SDA church keeps the strictest literal interpretation of the Old Testament that I've ever seen. In addition to Tithe, they also don't eat pork, or shellfish, they don't engage in commerce on the Sabbath, and a lot of other things. Why should I care if the tithing requirement was given along with the same set of rules that said clothing with more than one fabric is forgiven and that mentruating women were unclean, etc? What's your point? You think that I pick and choose the rules I want to follow? WRONG. Nice try though. We know that in Leviticus 11 God told Moses to tell the ISRAELITES not to eat certain foods because they are unclean for them. In Genesis, God said He has given us dominion over all the creatures of the land and the sea and that they will all be food for us. Jesus also said that what goes into your mouth is not unclean. Contradictions? Absolutely not. He was talking to different people specifically at different times and giving sets of rules for them that may not have been applicable to the other people from other lands. Maybe there was more disease and plague in one part of the land, or at a specific time, than in other parts. I don't know. Interpret it as you want.

That's it. Quick responses, or I'm done. That's a threat! I don't want to wade through 2 pages of plagiarized dialogue, I want Mindia's answers. Why is judging so easy? What Bible should I read? Why is Faith good enough for you, but not good enough for the Jehova's Witnesses? Go.

I hope you're satisfied, because I've answered every one of your questions that a reasonable person would regard to as being "acceptable" answers. I feel like I'm talking to children that ride the little yellow bus when I'm talking to you folks. It's very frustrating when I'm being clear as day and you still don't get it.

by **Narrock** » Thu Mar 18, 2004 3:59 pm

I'd like to hear what your opinion is of the Catholics and Mormons. Leave out the faith-based verbage please.

by **Spazz** » Thu Mar 18, 2004 4:14 pm

Mindia have you been taking stupid lessons from lead ?

by **DangerPaul** » Thu Mar 18, 2004 4:19 pm

Because I know Jesus, and I know the Bible

Can you hook me up with an autograph? I could make some money on Ebay with that.

by **catseye nameless** » Thu Mar 18, 2004 4:53 pm

Contradictions? Absolutely not. He was talking to different people specifically at different times and giving sets of rules for them that may not have been applicable to the other people from other lands. Maybe there was more disease and plague in one part of the land, or at a specific time, than in other parts. I don't know. Interpret it as you want.

maybe this "god" character was just retarded

by **vonkaar** » Thu Mar 18, 2004 5:17 pm

Alright... I have to ask, are you serious? Taxx is a famous troll that often posts rants just to spark a response. I have to think that you are doing the same... nobody could possibly be writing in such a way without knowing how they are sounding.

I'm dead serious... you are quite possibly, no strike that, you are the worst debater I have ever... ever run into online. I have 5,000 ezBoard posts... 1,000 euph posts, 12,000 offtopic posts, 2,000 overclocker posts and probably a trillion posts on Usenet. I wouldn't say that I'm a message board junkie, I simply enjoy a good discussion. I have *never* seen anyone argue like this. Would it ruin your 'cover' to admit that you are 'faking' the idiot guise? PM me if you'd like to keep your 'true' identity secret, I'll understand. I honestly cannot believe that you really ARE this bad.

This *is* my last post here. To say that this debate has become frustrating would (now) be a lie. I'm past frustration... it's reached 'disbelief'. I've even dedicated a new emoticon to you.

Analogies, metaphors and drawing comparisons...

Vonkaar is to sexy as The French are to stinky.

A perfect analogy.

Mindia judging 100 million Christians (that he's never met) and condemning them to Hell.
!=
Vonkaar's raging hatred towards a man that raped a ten year old girl.

A 'not' perfect analogy.

I'm still trying to decide if you were serious when you wrote that. I'll be honest... I stopped reading at this point. I'm going to leave this thread and let everyone else continue laughing at you. If another religious rant springs up, I'll simply skip over your posts. It's either the pain, the pity or the frustration that will always serve as a reminder to avoid you in the future.

Mindia is to Leadaira as a lungful of carbon monoxide is to a nice... clean breath of fresh air. I never thought that I'd miss his/her posts =/.

by **brinstar** » Thu Mar 18, 2004 5:39 pm

that occurred to me too vonk

the problem, though, is that even if he WAS faking it this whole time, if he finally came clean and said "i was just fucking with you guys the whole time" we wouldn't believe him at all

by **Narrock** » Thu Mar 18, 2004 6:03 pm

Vonkaar, there was a point in time when I actually thought you were an intelligent person. I was painfully mistaken. I can't believe you're actually that dense that you can't understand simple logic and reasoning, and YOU CAN'T EVEN ANSWER A SIMPLE QUESTION!!!
After all your bullshit you still refuse to have a discussion. You just can't keep from getting hung up on non-related issues. Where are your debating skills? I haven't seen them yet. When you're ready for a logical discussion... let me know. To be honest, all I've seen from you is immaturity, sarcasm, 3rd-grade level comprehension, and subject-at-hand-avoidance-and-loopholing. This is beyond bizarre, but I'm willing to give you another chance.

I'll ask again, and this goes for everybody as well...

What do you think of the Mormons and Catholics believing themselves to be Christians (by Biblical definition) after seeing Mormon doctrine and having read about what the Catholics believe in?

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