The Colts are for real

[Tikker]

their offense has been great for a few years now, but now that the defense is a top 10 unit, I think it's safe to say they're the super bowl favourite now

Not often you can end a football game against a top 5 team on your 1st offensive play of the game, jeje

[Reynaldo]

Add to that, the only thing that slows them down at all (weather elements, crowd noise) is completely negated by home field advantage through the playoffs and the super bowl being in a dome.

Might as well start up next season now.

[Minrott]

Yeah, I have to agree now. For the last part of the season I'd been saying Cinci would beat them, or Pitts would beat them. I don't think they'll lose a game now, all the way through.

[Tikker]

well, we'll see how the playoffs go

as a bit of an aside, the steelers did play them pretty tough at times, and they just had a bunch of guys come back from injury and you could see the rust on them a bit


(not making excuses for the loss, most other teams would have been down 14, or 21-0 after Indy's initial onslaught)


ps, I had no idea that the Colts would be able to stop the run

Picking up Simon and that new safety made a big fucking difference

[Spliffs]

I'll agree they are the favorites, but I also wouldn't be the least bit shocked to see them get thumped by Denver in the AFC championship, or thumped by Seattle, Dallas, or Carolina in the super bowl.

[Tikker]

I still don't think that the top NFC team can compete with any of the top 5 AFC teams at this point

Denver is dangerous tho if Plummer stays hot

[Durck]

I still don't think that the top NFC team can compete with any of the top 5 AFC teams at this point

Denver is dangerous tho if Plummer stays hot

Im dumbfounded Plummer has played as good as he has. He was THE SUCK (defined) for the Cardinals.

-Duck

[Thon]

Im dumbfounded Plummer has played as good as he has. He was THE SUCK (defined) for the Cardinals.

key words right there

[Lyion]

Denver won't be beating Indy. They don't match up well with Manning.

I read somewhere Shanahan has somewhat shackled Plummer from just throwing the ball up. Now that he is not making the boneheaded throws he's known for, he's turned into a pretty good QB.

Interestingly enough, Denver's first playoff game could end up being New England at home.

[Tikker]

I don't think I would want to be the team that has to play either Pittsburgh or Cincinatti in the 1st round(whichever one of those 2 ends up the wild card team)

[Goose_Man]

I'm looking forward to the Colts / Seahawks game on Christmas eve... should be a dandy!


GO HAWKS

[Goose_Man]

Denver won't be beating Indy. They don't match up well with Manning.

I read somewhere Shanahan has somewhat shackled Plummer from just throwing the ball up. Now that he is not making the boneheaded throws he's known for, he's turned into a pretty good QB.

Interestingly enough, Denver's first playoff game could end up being New England at home.

Yeah Shanahan really buckled down on him to stop being such a bonner.

They were all over hit nuts on the thanksgiving game versus the cowboys about how he hasn’t thrown an interception in over 235 passes. Then good ol' plummer decided to try and use his brain and lobbed one up and get it intercepted.. I just had to laugh.

[Phlegm]

Pittsburgh did well against the Colts defensively after the 80 yards touchdown pass. The Colts only score one more touchdown after that when Cowher decided to onside kick at the start of the second half which failed and gave the colts a short field.

[Tikker]

if steelers had been at full strength (ie, no starters just coming back from major injury) it might have been different, but credit where it's due, the Colts played very well, and definately deserved the win

[Phlegm]

We'll see how good the Steelers really is when they play the Bengals this weekend.

[Tikker]

steelers already owned the bengals once

it's the bengals that need to prove they're not a product of a weak schedule

[Lyion]

steelers already owned the bengals once

it's the bengals that need to prove they're not a product of a weak schedule

There are no gimme games in the NFL. Well, maybe Houston, but no others!

Cinci and Pitt are both good teams. I think the game will revolve around two things: Whether Cinci can stop the run <which they haven't much this year>, and turnovers.

If the weather is nice and it becomes a shootout, Cinci will win this game.

[Tikker]

The colts (a better offensive team than the bengals) playing in a dome only really had 1 big play against the steelers

I'm not really concerned with the bengals offense as the steelers match up pretty well against them (The colts have those 2 TE's that make mismatches, as well as Edge)

The bengals don't run the ball well enough to force the steelers to bring 8 to the line

[Lyion]

I don't think it's Cinci's running the ball, which they've done decently all year, but how good Pitts front 7 is. They didn't bring 8 up against Indy and stopped Edge for the most part.

Also, if Cinci WRs didn't drop/miss 3 passes in the endzone, the last Pitt/Cinci game would've been completely different.

We know Pitt will stop the run, mostly. The question is whether the Bengals can likewise slow down Pitts running game.

Cinci needs to load up in the box like Indy did and make Roesthlisberger beat them. Especially with Tory James and Deltha O'Neil playing as well as they have.

[Minrott]

Except I think Roethlisberger can beat Cinci's secondary. They don't mask as well as Indi, and while Pits recieving core isn't star studded, they quietly get their jobs done.

[Goose_Man]

Payton is a good QB yes but I think he is very over rated. He's just lucky he has a damn good line.. Just look at his stats in and out of the pocket. If you can get him on the run their offense just falls apart.

[Lyion]

I disagree. Peytons line looks good because Manning sees the field so well and gets rid of the ball fast. They are not that great, to be honest.

Also, he can read defenses better than anyone who ever played the game. D's have to mask moreso against Manning than anyone else.

[Arlos]

he can read defenses better than anyone who ever played the game

That's a pretty bold statement right there. Do you honestly think that Peyton is better at picking a defense apart than, say, Joe Montana? How about Johnny Unitas?

He's good, no doubt, he may even be better than anyone else playing today (especially since Favre is definitely on the downside of his career), but best EVER? I doubt that.

This actually did raise a question in my mind too, actually. Where are all the great quarterbacks today? I mean, it wasn't THAT long ago that we had Montana, Elway, Marino, etc. all playing at the same time. Hell, go to 91ish, and you can add in Young and maybe even Aikman to that list. Today, who do we have that's GREAT, ie, Hall of Fame for sure? Manning, definitely, but anyone else? Tom Brady quite possibly, yes. Favre used to be, but isn't now. Vick is a running back who throws occasionally. Roethlisburger may be one eventually, but his job is more to manage the game, not win with his arm. McNair? Good, but not great. McNabb? Same thing. I dunno about anyone else, but I sure can't think of anyone else who's even close to HOF caliber.

-Arlos

[Ouchyfish]

Add to the fact that most of the AFC sucks major balls. Gone are the days of marino, kelly, esiason, elway, etc. If they had to play miami, miami would beat them. Not sure if most of you folks remember the 85 bears and how everyone swore they would DESTROY the dolphins that year when they -almost- went undefeated. Quite possibly my favorite MNF of all time.

Baltimore: 3-8
Jacksonville (8-3) (won by 7)
Cleveland 4-7
Tennesee 3-8
San Fran 2-9
St Louis 5-6
Houston 1-10
New England 6-5
Houston 1-10
Cincinatti 8-3 (8 point win)
Pittsburgh 7-4

Not exactly powerhouse schedule there. They're one of the better teams, but I wouldn't call them awesome. I would call them beneficiaries of a sweet schedule.

Let's face it. Out of the 16 teams in the AFC, I would only consider 4 of them as having anything other than a so-so year. I honestly don't think Indy could beat Jacksonville a second time. Their wins against decent teams only came at a 7-8 point margin.

They might go undefeated. The AFC is weak enough to allow it to happen.








For Dolphin fans--here's an article written by Mike Diegnan:

Dan Marino never won a Super Bowl, but his mark in league history is undeniable. His complete arsenal was at work when he cracked holes in Buddy Ryan's infamous "46" defense.

Ryan's "46" defense had allowed 10 points or fewer in nine of Chicago's first 12 games and had not allowed a touchdown in 13 quarters when it headed to Miami on Dec. 2, 1985, just four games away from becoming the second team in NFL history to go through a season perfect. The league's most feared team was seemingly getting better each week, outscoring its past three opponents 104-3.

But with the 1972 Dolphins on the sidelines looking for the present team to save their legacy as the league's only perfect team, the media frenzy was wild. A local Miami television station even went to a zoo during the week to interview a dolphin and a bear.

Nat Moore runs into the end zone for one of his two touchdowns.
Whether that's how Don Shula and Marino were able to solve the Bears' famed defense or not, the Dolphins were able to put together a game plan that ripped apart the Bears as Miami cruised to a 38-24 victory.

"The beauty of the Chicago game was that it was the big, bad Bears coming to town," recalls former Dolphin wide receiver Nat Moore. "Everybody gave them a chance of going undefeated and winning it all. It was great offense against great defense, and that particular night, great offense won."

While much of the focus during the week leading up to the game was on the Dolphins maintaining the '72 team's place in history, Miami was in a bigger fight. The 8-4 Dolphins were battling with the New York Jets and New England Patriots for the AFC East crown.

"That's the old Dolphins," Moore says. "We were more concerned about the business at hand of trying to continue winning and have the best record in the AFC."

Miami had a plan to do that. Namely, the Dolphins had Marino, the third-year quarterback who could do things that no one else in the league could do. And protected by one of the league's best offensive lines, Miami was in position to attack the Bears.

"Their whole defense was predicated on the quarterback trying to make a throw with a free blitzer in his face 30 yards down the field," Moore says. "They would come up, they would play press corner with (Mike) Richardson and (Leslie) Frazier, and because they would bring eight people, they would always have a free blitzer. To try and make that kind of throw over outstretched arms, I don't care who the quarterback is, and make a perfect throw against a press corner 30 yards down the field, is a very difficult throw. And you aren't going to have great success, especially when you are throwing off your back foot."

But Marino could hold the ball longer than most quarterbacks. And Miami's plan was to exploit the "46" defense by getting the ball to the tight end position with short passes, which would force safety Gary Fencik to cross the field to make the tackle.

"The worst-case scenario if he makes the tackle is that it's a five-yard gain instead of a negative play where you get sacked or throw it incomplete," says the 5-foot-9, 184-pound Moore, who lined up at different positions all night, notably at tight end.

And if Fencik missed the tackle?

That's exactly what happened on the Dolphins' first possession when Marino hit Moore on a crossing pattern, eluded Fencik and raced untouched 33 yards to give the Dolphins an early 7-0 lead.

The Bears struck back with a 69-yard pass from Steve Fuller (starting in place of the injured Jim McMahon) to Willie Gault down to the Miami 11. After a delay of a couple of minutes because of crowd noise, fullback Matt Suhey carried the ball down to the 1 before Fuller snuck in to tie the game (William "The Refrigerator" Perry was in the backfield but had no impact on the play).

Up 10-7 after a Fuad Reveiz field goal, Marino and Moore connected again for a 22-yard play down to the Chicago 18 that set up a Ron Davenport touchdown run to give Miami a 17-7 advantage.

Chicago cut the lead to 17-10 before Marino went to work again. On third-and-12, he hit a wide-open Mark Duper on a crossing pattern for 52 yards. Then on third-and-7, he connected with Mark Clayton for 26 yards down to the Bears 1. Davenport rumbled in for his second score, and the Dolphins led 24-10 with 1:57 left in the half.


Buddy Ryan's defense set a new level of dominance in Super Bowl XX, but it couldn't solve Dan Marino and the Dolphins.
The Dolphins weren't done. William Judson blocked the Bears' subsequent punt, giving Miami possession at the Chicago 6. Two plays later, Marino hit Moore for his second touchdown to give the Dolphins a stunning 31-10 halftime lead. The Bears had not allowed 31 points in one half since the 1972 season opener.

The Bears pulled to within 31-17 with 9:25 left in the third quarter. But any momentum they might have gained was lost wicker Kevin Butler muffed the ensuing kickoff, which Dolphins rookie Alex Moyer recovered at the Bears 46.

The Bears' chances of a perfect season then hibernated three plays later when on third-and-6, defensive end Dan Hampton tipped a Marino pass into the air. The ball sailed 30 yards downfield before landing in the hands of a wide-open Clayton, who pranced into the end zone to make it 38-17.

Fuller hit Ken Margerum for a 19-yard touchdown to cut the lead to 14, but the Bears couldn't rally further.

The loss proved to be the only blemish in an otherwise dream season for Chicago. The Bears went on to finish the regular season 15-1 and cruise through the postseason in one of the most dominating runs in NFL history. The Bears pummeled the Giants 21-0 in the NFC Divisional Playoffs and then routed the Rams 24-0 in the NFC championship game.

A much-anticipated rematch against the Dolphins in Super Bowl XX was thwarted when the New England Patriots upset Miami 31-14 in the AFC championship game at the Orange Bowl. The Bears then crushed the Patriots 46-10 in the Superdome to earn their first and only Lombardi Trophy.

But on that December night, the Dolphins tasted the champagne as another team's run at perfection ended, and Marino's magic was on display.

[Lyion]

he can read defenses better than anyone who ever played the game

That's a pretty bold statement right there. Do you honestly think that Peyton is better at picking a defense apart than, say, Joe Montana? How about Johnny Unitas?

He's good, no doubt, he may even be better than anyone else playing today (especially since Favre is definitely on the downside of his career), but best EVER? I doubt that.

Yep, I watched all of Montana's games having grown up in California and near the bay area when he was playing. Montana was an amazing clutch player, but like Brady a lot of his success stems from the fact San Fran also had a superb D and a system that was very good to QBs, and even today makes mediocre QBs look good. Montana was a piece of the puzzle in San Fran, and even when he was gone their team with that system was still great. Steve Young had more to overcome than Joe, because San Fran did not have the killer D, and teams had slowly figured out how to defend the WCO.

Unitas was from a different era. Like Montana, he didn't have to face the same challenges as Peyton. The complex schemes, zone blitzes, and level of athleticism even in the 80s wasn't what it is today, and it certainly wasn't in the 60s.

Is Peyton the best QB ever? Nope. Is he the best ever at reading Ds? In my mind, definitely.

Of course, it's all opinion.