Undercover Mosque report in England

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Undercover Mosque report in England

Postby Lueyen » Wed Jan 17, 2007 2:33 pm

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9MSFbhIG-sk

This report recently aired in the UK, and I found it a bit unnerving.

After pointing out to someone advocating the burning of the Quran that book burning was a method employed by fascists oppressive governments, I was told to read the Quran, which admittedly I have never done. Avoiding biased translations, I asked a Muslim I know what he thought a fair representation in English translations would be, and ordered it. I'm now about a quarter of the way through it and frankly I'm reserving judgment until I've completed the work simply because I don't believe I can form an accurate opinion of it without the perspective of the whole. While I tend to have a problem with parts of a whole as a conclusive example of an idea.. I found this video to be very disturbing. Regardless if parts of these speeches are argument or conclusion, I don't see how they could possibly be taken out of context to appear worse then they were.
Raymond S. Kraft wrote:The history of the world is the history of civilizational clashes, cultural clashes. All wars are about ideas, ideas about what society and civilization should be like, and the most determined always win.

Those who are willing to be the most ruthless always win. The pacifists always lose, because the anti-pacifists kill them.
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Re: Undercover Mosque report in England

Postby Narrock » Wed Jan 31, 2007 9:59 pm

Lueyen wrote:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9MSFbhIG-sk

This report recently aired in the UK, and I found it a bit unnerving.

After pointing out to someone advocating the burning of the Quran that book burning was a method employed by fascists oppressive governments, I was told to read the Quran, which admittedly I have never done. Avoiding biased translations, I asked a Muslim I know what he thought a fair representation in English translations would be, and ordered it. I'm now about a quarter of the way through it and frankly I'm reserving judgment until I've completed the work simply because I don't believe I can form an accurate opinion of it without the perspective of the whole. While I tend to have a problem with parts of a whole as a conclusive example of an idea.. I found this video to be very disturbing. Regardless if parts of these speeches are argument or conclusion, I don't see how they could possibly be taken out of context to appear worse then they were.


Dammit, the video was removed already
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Postby Tikker » Wed Jan 31, 2007 10:42 pm

from the outside, all religions look pretty whacked
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Postby Lueyen » Thu Feb 01, 2007 2:40 am

Raymond S. Kraft wrote:The history of the world is the history of civilizational clashes, cultural clashes. All wars are about ideas, ideas about what society and civilization should be like, and the most determined always win.

Those who are willing to be the most ruthless always win. The pacifists always lose, because the anti-pacifists kill them.
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Postby Lueyen » Thu Feb 01, 2007 2:45 am

Tikker wrote:from the outside, all religions look pretty whacked


Tikker I can only imagine the lather you'd work yourself into if these were Christian preachers in churches in what is considered main stream. If you haven't watched the videos please do and then come back and tell me that what you see gives you no cause for concern and you can easily dismiss what was said as being seemingly whacked due to viewing it from the outside. I can see where some of it might possibly have been taken out of context, but a lot of it would concern me in ANY context.
Raymond S. Kraft wrote:The history of the world is the history of civilizational clashes, cultural clashes. All wars are about ideas, ideas about what society and civilization should be like, and the most determined always win.

Those who are willing to be the most ruthless always win. The pacifists always lose, because the anti-pacifists kill them.
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Postby kaharthemad » Thu Feb 01, 2007 7:17 am

man I watched 2 of the vids so far..this shit scares me
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Postby Darcler » Thu Feb 01, 2007 9:58 am

I'm only on the second one. I have a very hard time watching this. Not because of the content, but because so much is spliced together to make it sound MUCH worse. There is a huge bias on this, and I hate watching one sided programs.
Like Lue, I will reserve judgement. This is not my religion and I dont know the whole of it. All I know of it are the pieces that people like to dredge up in arguements and stupid videos like this.
While the parts I have seen are bad, the same can be said of other religions. Bits and pieces of the Bible are pretty harsh as well. I've been to churches that have taught a pretty intolerant service.
I'll continue watching, but I have a huge feeling all this is being spliced into a bit being out of context.
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Postby Tikker » Thu Feb 01, 2007 1:30 pm

Lueyen wrote:
Tikker wrote:from the outside, all religions look pretty whacked


Tikker I can only imagine the lather you'd work yourself into if these were Christian preachers in churches in what is considered main stream.


it wouldn't be any different

your invisible man in the sky isn't any different than their invisible man in the sky
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Postby Narrock » Thu Feb 01, 2007 2:11 pm

What a bunch of evil bastards. I don't know the answer in how to deal with these lunatics, but if the entire non-muslim world turned against them, that may just be the only solution.
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