If you had to pick a religion

[xaoshaen]

So, youre telling me that my morality comes from a god. I dont care which god youre talking about. Please then, enlighten me as to your religion.

For now, let's say I worship literacy, which would make you a fucking infidel.

I never, ever told you that your morality comes from a god. I never even implied as much.

Let me rephrase for the literalists. I can say, with as much certainty as I can say about anything, that Yahweh, the god of the OT, NT, Book of Mormon, what have you, does not exist. People claim he exists. People claim he has direct influence over my life, and the decisions I make and how I make them. Yet there is zero evidence for this.

So, essentially what you're saying is that you're incapable of actually proving anything? You've essentially admitted that you can't disprove the existence of a god, but you can't say anything with greater certainty than that?

It isnt my responsibility to prove he doesnt exist. If that was the way it worked, why dont you believe in the tooth fairy? Im pretty sure you cant prove she doesnt exist.

It wasn't your responsibility until you claimed that you could in fact say that Yahweh did not exist. This is what is known as your mouth writing a check that your ass can't cash. I have never claimed that the ability to categorically state that the Tooth Fairy does not exist. This is because I have an elementary grasp of logic and comprehend the rank stupidity of attempting to prove a negative.

[Lyion]

Don't forget some believe in Baptism of Desire, Xao. It's a contested issue in Catholicism

I'm not particularly well-versed inCatholic dogma, but as far as I understand it, the Baptism of Desire debate largely revolves around mechanics: do you need to be dipped under the water, or is acknowledging Jesus Christ as your lord and savior sufficient?

Ignorance of the Church is not considered a sin. Just like Babies are not damned, neither are those who are not exposed.

if you learn the church and reject it you are not saved. If your heart is pure and you do not learn of the church, then you can still achieve salvation, although this is a debated issue.

There are different viewpoints at different Vatican council and a lot of different verses which support both sides of the argument.

The underlying message taught at Catechism for salvation is we recieve the sacraments <when we can> and that we believe and practice what He has taught.

[Yamori]

I respect people who make a lot of effort to be certain of things, even if they are wrong - far more than I do philosophical wimps who give up and say we can't know anything about anything.

Also you guys who won't give an answer are disappointing. Do some imaginative thinking and expand your mind!!

As for god, I can't disprove its existence anymore than I can disprove the ethereal invisible 7 headed unicorn that travels the galaxies searching for the perfect invisible ethereal magic mushroom to munch on. To be technical I cannot, but common sense dictates what I should believe.

[Harrison]

I respect people who make a lot of effort to be certain of things, even if they are wrong - far more than I do philosophical wimps who give up and say we can't know anything about anything.

Yeah DAMN those people with the educated response...

I laugh at both sides of the fence. Neither of you know shit and prance around like you know how the universe works.

First the world was without a doubt flat.

Now there is without a doubt NO higher power.

Don't make me laugh.

[xaoshaen]

I respect people who make a lot of effort to be certain of things, even if they are wrong - far more than I do philosophical wimps who give up and say we can't know anything about anything.

Also you guys who won't give an answer are disappointing. Do some imaginative thinking and expand your mind!!

Sorry man, but I'm not prosetelyzing anything but rationality. Did I follow a religion, and were I inclined to try and convert someone, I'd do it through actions, not posts on a messageboard.

As for god, I can't disprove its existence anymore than I can disprove the ethereal invisible 7 headed unicorn that travels the galaxies searching for the perfect invisible ethereal magic mushroom to munch on. To be technical I cannot, but common sense dictates what I should believe.

Pascal's Wager indicates that lacking conclusive evidence one way or the other, the rational man chooses to believe in a god. Quite frankly, I would find his argument more compelling than a blanket "common sense" statement.

[Harrison]

You live a VERY empty life if you sit around saying shit like:

"What has God ever done for me? There must be no God, my mother died of cancer"
etc.

"I am not going to believe in some magical all seeing bearded old man in the sky!"
Hello stupidity, how are you?

"If there is a God, why did he allow the tsunami?!"
Fucking moronic


I see this shit all the time and if you base your beliefs off of ignorant drivel like that...I feel bad for your children and our genepool.

[Yamori]

Yeah DAMN those people with the educated response...

Very few people who say "I don't know" to everything are educated. Most of the time it is out of laziness or out of fear.

I'd rather see a person live a life of trying to know how the world works, and trying to distinguish right from wrong, than to just have them give up, join the cult of human impotence, and be just another meaningless dreg.

Look at history and all it's accomplishments: how many of the people that we consider to be great just shrugged their shoulders and said "I dunno."?

[Harrison]

Just because I accept that I know jack squat in this universe does not mean that I don't try to figure out as much as possible while I am here.

I am not an arrogant little prick who sits around saying "I know there is no [insert ignorance here]"

If anything, the ignorant ones are those.

[Almegest Victory]

LOL Do you know anything about Buddhism Almegest? It offers no salvation! I wasn't picking on it, trolling, or being a smartass. Buddhism's basic premises (in so many words) are to be a good person, treat others as you would like to be treated, etc. etc. etc. but it offers NO SALVATION of eternal life such as in Christianity.

Think before you speak up, or google it or something.

Here's a good website in which you can educate yourself:

http://www.religioustolerance.org/buddhism.htm

The mother of my child is buddhist, thank you for basically saying her and my son are going to hell. Now kindly fuck off.

[Adivina]

Don't worry Al, if he were not so ignorant he would realize that Buddism involves eternal life through the cycle of reincarnation. Also many Buddist branches (as of course there are different variations) believe that once one has transcended the six realms of suffering that they will be reborn in Pureland, which is much like "heaven".

Call it what you want, Vahala, Pureland, Shangi'La, Heaven..... it all boils down to the same basic principle.

[Harrison]

Who gives a fuck what it offers?

It's not a fucking subscription with benefits for joining.

[Adivina]

Its not the reason to enter into a religion, but it surely is something that people take comfort in. However, some religions are less concerned with "rewards" than others.

[Yamori]

I personally don't care for buddhism, since "nirvana" is really just a wish for death or the nullification of the self, wrapped up in fancy metaphysical wrapping paper.

I also don't care for the sentiment that attachment is suffering: I think that attachment is actually the only source of joy in life - you just have to be careful about what you become attached to.

Still, I respect if for being one of the better religions in existence, especially because of the value it places on reason. It's much more psychologically healthy than most, and I'd be pleased enough if Buddhism were the mainstream religion of most countries.

[Adivina]

I feel the same about the attachment thing Yam.

[Gidan]

Who gives a fuck what it offers?

It's not a fucking subscription with benefits for joining.

Really? What religion are you and why are you that religion?

[Yamori]

Who gives a fuck what it offers?

It's not a fucking subscription with benefits for joining.

Yeah, I disagree with that.

There are a lot of religions that are in the most part a way of life. Buddhism, Taoism, Satanism, Thelema, Wicca, Paganism, ect are all religions that don't say "I am the one and only."

Weighing the benefits and disadvantages of it isn't something absurd.

[Harrison]

There's no way you can be serious.

Deciding on your belief for the existence of an all powerful being (or lack of one) is not like deciding what you're going to eat.

Hmm I like the soup better, I'll go with that. It tastes better than that possible reality over there.

I've never had the possible reality but I don't want to eat it, I'll go with this soup instead.

Plus, I get breadsticks with the soup!

[Gidan]

I see you completely avoided the question. Well let me add another question you probably will not answer. How do you decide what religion you are going to be? How do you decide what your going to beleive? Do you just blindly follow something having no idea what it is your following?

[Harrison]

I THINK FOR MYSELF

It's simple really. Some of you should try it some time.

[Gidan]

And what do you get out of that?

[Harrison]

[Gidan]

So you think for yourself for the sake of thinking for yourself.

[Arlos]

For me, I never believed in the catholic teachings, even when I went through confirmation. Did it because it was expected of me, and my parents wanted me to do it. Once I left for college, I had nothing more to do with religion, and finally after a year or so, convinced my parents to stop attempting to force me to go to mass on those religious holidays I was home for (xmas, easter depending on when I was home for spring break, etc.) Wasn't particularly anything for a while, finally heard some stuff that fit what I already believed in anyway, researched the tenets of the religion I am now, found that it was pretty much a universal fit with my beliefs, attitudes and concepts of how things worked, so it wasn't a matter of choosing a religion and then believing, it was already believing and finding the religion that matched my beliefs.

That said, I still am utterly convinced of the fact that morality, concern for your fellow man, and the desire for an equitable society is in no way necessarily based on any form of religious faith. Yes, many religions do teach valuable moral lessons, but many also preach intolerance of anyone who believes differently. Yes, even Christianity, at least some sects. Just look at Mindia.

-Arlos

[Lyion]

Still, I respect if for being one of the better religions in existence, especially because of the value it places on reason. It's much more psychologically healthy than most, and I'd be pleased enough if Buddhism were the mainstream religion of most countries.

This is an opinion, and certainly not a fact. Something tells me you haven't exactly studied the Ti pitaka, as this opinion is not well supported by any argument.

Interestingly enough, given people's lack of adherence to Christian principles, Buddhism is even more stringent and would be more difficult physically and less psychologically supportive for many so I completely disagree with your point that its healthier in any way. It certainly can be argued that it is less compassionate than other religions.

Given the Western way of life, the idea of complete detachment from any sort of comfort or possession would really not hold a lot of gain for us. In fact, it is adverse to the Western Lifestyle and would be completely the opposite of what you are trying to say here . Perhaps for YOU it might be better, but as a mainstream religion for society it would be terrible. Unless, of course, you expect it to be merely paid lip service like so many do with Christianity. Although Christianity allows the ceasar/god split whereis true Buddhism does not.

The base tenets of Buddhism, transmigration and karma, are also still a matter of faith, but also are very negative and without the light of other religions. I personally don't think a religion that preaches that life is not worth living, and that every form of conscious existence is evil is psychologically healthy for a society.

[Drem]

were i to pick a religion, i would probably also choose zen buddhism. however, i live currently without gnosis