Bush vetoes bill on children's health care

[Lyion]

One, I knew someone would bring up the Iraq War. That has nothing to do with THIS BILL, so sorry if I won't argue Bushitler derangement with a tax increase. Congress also funds that. Feel free to write them and say no. It has nothing to do with S-CHIP.

Second, this has very little to do with POOR KIDS. It is about EXPANDING coverage up the income ladder. This program already covers poor kids. The DNC wants it to as a replacement for private health care. Most of the people the DNC are trying to dole out cash to support are middle class. I am middle class and my kids will be eligible for S-CHIP. So, more taxpayer dollars, less percentage going to the needy. Got it?

Anyways, it's all evil Bush and his hatred of kids.. Except that's ridiculous, he'll fund the S-CHIP program and even increase the dollars to it. He rightly isn't allowing socialized health care that will be another train wreck of costs, even if those who don't comprehend this bill will howl in outrage in regards to it. What's new.

[Martrae]

So, fuck you for claiming it is a cop-out. It was a real situation, it was a real injury, and no matter how much my parents might wanted to have taken on that level of financial burden so that I could have had proper care for the knee, they simply couldn't do it. The brace was sufficient to allow me to at least limp around once I was off crutches, pain was just something I had to deal with. I don't blame my parents at all for how things worked out, I blame the system. If we'd lived in a country with a real health care system like Canada, or anywhere in western Europe, my parents' income level would've been irrelevant, I could've had proper care and surgery. Only in America...

-Arlos

Brilliant! Blame the system for something your parents did (or didn't do in this situation). It's easier to blame some nameless faceless system than admit to yourself that someone you loved let you down, isn't it?

[Arlos]

Oh yes, those horrible congresspeople. Trying to ease the financial burden on lower-mid to middle-class parents! How awful that they might make it easier for parents to raise a healthy family! How horrible that an average family might be able to afford health care without having to make heroic sacrifices in other areas in order to afford it!

You admit yourself that the new bill will still cover poor kids, so how is it harming them? Answer, it isn't.

Again, this is NOT government-run health care. Period. All this does is provide dollars to allow families to buy PRIVATE INSURANCE. Blue Cross, Blue Shield, Kaiser, Aetna, Bumblefuck Jones, whoever in hell you want to get. There's no restriction of choice, no government telling you who to go to, period. You go to who you want to, the government taxes smokers to help pay for it.

THE HORRORS!

-Arlos

[Tikker]

it sorta seems like socialism tho arlos, so it terrifies them

[Evermore]

Have you even read this bill? cause it dont look like it. you are spouting bush's bullshit excuse for the veto like it is actually true. the DNC does NOT want it as a replacement. btw this gem here:

I am middle class and my kids will be eligible for S-CHIP. So, more taxpayer dollars, less percentage going to the needy. Got it?

Is typical of government in general, its just more prevalent under president fucktard. You seem to forget who is the most taxed and basically supports this country. ITS THE MIDDLE CLASS.

/sarcasm on

Oh yes lets tax a bad and deadly substance and use the money to help some children. GOD FUCKING FORBID someone actually BENEFITS from government stealing er spending.

/sarcasm off

Whats next with this shit? I know, Bush will be able to come into your house, fuck your wife, drink your beer, piss on your shoes, then pass a law to make it legal and you would support it. I hope bush never has to stop short, he going to have quite a few heads go right up his ass.

[Tikker]

the british actually used to have that law, prime nocte(sp)

[Lyion]

I have no idea what you are talking about Ever.

This bill expands S-CHIP to most of the middle class. It replaces the old S-CHIP which was limited to those at 200% over poverty. What part do you disagree with me about?

Also, most cigg's are sold to the lower income people.. Soooo, let's tax the poor more to pay for Middle Class health care?

[Tikker]

where did you get that statistic from?

I'd like to see the stat

[Harrison]

Cigarettes should be $20 a pack, let's see who will keep up their bullshit then.

[Evermore]

what i am disagreeing with is your support of the veto. the middle class now includes people that work for companies that do not offer health care. this program allows them to purchase coverage for their kids. THis includes contractors. as it stands now this program does not cover these lower middle class people. go look at the stats. btw please post where you are getting your statistics on the cigarette smokers. I am also disagreeing with your focusing on the middle class expansion. this is NOT going to exclude the lower class it is allowing access to more people. Children mostly. and the lower class who does smoke more are also the ones that are going to need more coverage cause they are more likely to get sick.


sides the tax might make it too expensive for them to smoke anymore and force some to quit.

[Evermore]

http://www.oralcancerfoundation.org/tobacco/demographics_tobacco.htm


there are the smoking stats

[Lyion]

the british actually used to have that law, prime nocte(sp)

Until William Wallace beat them down.

Ever, that is not support for the poor. You support free health care paid for by the federal government. I do not. This is the same tact used before to try and introduce federal government controlled medical coverage.

Also, feel free to stat check any page on smokers and see how many low income people smoke and how often. Heck, check who on this board will get hammered. It won't be the upper middle class types. Your site linked backs up what I posted.

Also, it's ironic you have a libertarian Republican for president icon while pushing a position 180 degree's against what Ron Paul envisions...

[Evermore]

it is ironic. I never said I agree with him on all his points this is one i do not. however with the available choises I would give this one up to see him get elected. it is by far the best candidate.

[Tossica]

If I am going to pay taxes anyway, I would rather the money go to health care than for corporate welfare, war, other bullshit.

[Diekan]

i love how anything remotely social triggers this insane anti-communism style fear in certain right wingers

Yes, because your country's social health care system works so well, Canadians are flocking to the US to get care.

"What's that Mr. Tikker? You think you have cancer? I'm sorry to hear that, we should be able to get you in to see a doctor in ohhhhh six months, is that ok?

*six months later*

"You were right Mr. Tikker, you DO have cancer, but we're sorry you're now in the later stages of the disease, had you been diagnosed sooner we might have been able to save you, but you see, you had to stand in line behind Joe who had a toe nail fungus..."

You can keep your socialized medicine. There's a very good reason people (who live in countries with that idiotic system) keep coming to the US for health care.

The United States government can't even deliver your fucking mail without a hitch - do you REALLY want them running a system that your very life may depend on?

I will agree that our current system IS fucked up, and I don't have a solution - but I will say that socializing it is NOT the answer.

I don't want to see anyone having to go without care, or treatment, or medication - but at the same time I sure as hell do not want a bunch of pompous, power hungry politicians deciding who gets to live and die, who gets treatment and who doesn't.

Make no mistake, neither the Democrats OR Republicans give one flying fuck about your life, health and wellbeing. They can give a shit less about the health of your children. What they want (BOTH of them) is power. Socializing the health care system gives them just that much more power over our lives. They don't have to worry - they're rich and powerful enough that you can bet your ass if they get sick they'll get treatment. But if YOU get sick - you're going to have to wait in line and pray that you see a doctor before it's too late.

Ohh and pray that doctor you get actually speaks English and not Swahili because I guarantee you that our best and brightest will not go into medicine once the government takes control of the entire system. Why should they? Why should the sacrifice their 20's and 30's for a mountain of student loan debt and a minuscule wage when they can use their intellect to make more money elsewhere?

Oh, but everything will be fine and dandy! Umm no. I have two words for those of you who think letting the US government run our health care system is a *good idea*.... Walter Reed.

Anyone who's been in the military, who's had to use the Veteran's administration should know what I'm talking about. Hell anyone who's read the paper over the past couple of years should know what I'm talking about.

VA hospitals are a prime glimpse of what we can expect once Uncle Sam starts running our health care system.

The doctor I was banging a while ago told me flat out that if Hillary Care ever became a reality - she was done practicing. Such is the sentiment amongst MANY doctors.

[Yamori]

IT'S FOR THE CHILDREN

[Evermore]

Diek, Canada's healthcare issue is not one of quality or how well it works it is one of resources.

[Tikker]

Diek, Canada's healthcare issue is not one of quality or how well it works it is one of resources.

it's amazing that anyone lives past 45 here!

[Evermore]

Diek, Canada's healthcare issue is not one of quality or how well it works it is one of resources.

it's amazing that anyone lives past 45 here!

ya most get drunk and get stuck in moose shit and freeze to death!

[Lyion]

Diek, Canada's healthcare issue is not one of quality or how well it works it is one of resources.

it's amazing that anyone lives past 45 here!

Not everyone gets sick. Also, not everyone reports they are sick, especially in a country the size and locale of Canada.

Also, you live near us. We have the best treatment centers in the world. Many of your sick cancer people who have the resources come here for treatment. Even your government people when they're sick come to the US in droves. I read an article yesterday on some of the bigwigs in Canada who promote the health care system, but came here when they had breast cancer.. Wish I had bookmarked it.

Sadly, if we go the same route in cheap subsidized care, we wouldn't have a wealthy, large nation to the south to leech the better care and facilities off of, and to send our people who need it to.

[Diekan]

Diek, Canada's healthcare issue is not one of quality or how well it works it is one of resources.

Like I said man, I don't have the answer - I wish I did. I would love to see everyone who gets ill get treatment without having to get a second mortgage to pay for it.

I just do not want the US government running it. I don't want my taxes to rocket through the roof to pay for it. You've got to consider the thinking of the American politician, when you do that you have to wonder what their true intentions are. Do they really care about the people of this country and are they doing this solely for our benefit, or are they wanting to do this simply for more power? Given the track record of governments handling of everything from the idiotic war on drugs to...well... you name it. Given them total power over the health care system does not sit well with me.

I know medical costs are out of control. I know we have problems with our current system. I just don't know if letting Uncle Sam take control is the best alternative.

[Zanchief]

Also, you live near us. We have the best treatment centers in the world. Many of your sick cancer people who have the resources come here for treatment.

Since our dollar has surpassed the US, and our life expectancy is higher (a few statistics you right wingers always ignore lolz), I'm not sure your conjecture is supported by anything.

Keep sucking down that propaganda though. I'm sure it's fueling those delusions of yours.

How's George W. Bush's legacy while we're at it. Do you want to amend your "George W Bush will go down in history as one of our greatest Presidents of all time" statement? I'm sure you based your assertion on some of those "statistics" we left-wingers seem to "ignore".

[Lyion]

Keep singing the praises of Harper. It does my ears well. Congratulations on strong and good economic leadership in Canada. I'm glad enough up North have gained a small semblance of common sense. It's a shame our conservative leaders aren't as good.

Maybe when your dollar is worth twice what ours is, you'll be able to afford your taxes and break even with us monetarily, and still have crappy health coverage. No wonder so many want to privatize it. Clueless people throw stats around that don't really help those poor people who die in Canada with cancer because they can't afford to come to America. It doesn't matter, though, since unlike in America, it's just your poor whom die. Our illegal immigrants who push our life stats down have a better chance at Cancer treatment than your poor people. Hey, I'll wave at you if you get anything and head here..

None of your bait changes the fact your hospitals suck, your wait times suck, and your politicians and well off people come here for most medical procedures.

[Evermore]

"George W Bush will go down in history as one of our greatest Presidents of all time"

this made me throw up in my mouth a little.

Wait here let me fix it

"George W Bush will go down in history as the Worst President of all time"

FIXT

[Zanchief]

Clueless people throw stats around

I couldn't agree more. And some people have the sense to ignore them.