Education in the USA

[Harrison]

I think it would be better to make schools compete for our children and for our tax dollars. It would also be great if good teachers were paid more than horrible ones.

I really can't think of a worse idea then this. It would be pretty much streamline schools so that kids would only be good at completely subjective grading methods so schools would get more money.

On top of that schools that need more money and more attention would just get less of both because they have more problems.

That is EXACTLY what is going on now.

[Martrae]

Actually, I dunno when, if ever, it was like you think it was.

I graduated from high school 20 years ago, and I can't think of a single person that had to be held back a year or flunked out. Of course, I was part of the crowd that was always in the AP classes, so it IS possible I would've missed someone from the other end of the spectrum, but when I just looked back over my yearbooks from back then, I didn't see anyone who started out in our class that later on showed up in the photo listing of a later class, which I consider pretty good evidence.

So, I think you may have some incorrect info there, though maybe if you're thinking of schools back in the 1800s you may have a point, I have no idea.

-Arlos

Are you kidding me? Kids at my school were held back or flunked all the time. I remember hitting 7th grade and having two 15 year olds in my class because they kept failing (they both dropped out mid-year when they hit 16).

My neighbor got held back a year. He was a year ahead of my brother and they graduated the same year.

[Drem]

Actually, I dunno when, if ever, it was like you think it was.

I graduated from high school 20 years ago, and I can't think of a single person that had to be held back a year or flunked out. Of course, I was part of the crowd that was always in the AP classes, so it IS possible I would've missed someone from the other end of the spectrum, but when I just looked back over my yearbooks from back then, I didn't see anyone who started out in our class that later on showed up in the photo listing of a later class, which I consider pretty good evidence.

uh, what? I only had 100 people in my tiny graduating class and 3 of them were held back from the grade ahead of us, 4 weren't allowed to walk with us, and 2 were held back another year. This was in 2003. Dunno why you'd think people don't get held back. Happens all the time. Gets even worse in college, too

[Kramer]

that would be funny if people phrased there time in college after 5 years as "being held back"

[leah]

i didn't know anyone held back in high school--if they were failing, they just dropped out. however, in grade school, i knew several people who were held back and it really ended up working out quite well for at least a couple of them.

[Drem]

:lol: that would be funny if people phrased there time in college after 5 years as "being held back"

lol. nobody has the stones to finish college in 4 years anymore unless they don't work. they just call themselves "super seniors" hahahaha

[leah]

:lol: that would be funny if people phrased there time in college after 5 years as "being held back"

lol. nobody has the stones to finish college in 4 years anymore unless they don't work. they just call themselves "super seniors" hahahaha

AHEM i finished in four years (almost 3.5 but the last art minor class i needed was in spring semester of my sr. year) AND i worked 25-30 hours a week. had a 3.7ish GPA, to boot.

[Drem]

that's not 40 hours. cheater

err, that's pretty sweet, and definitely not the norm. i envy your ethic~

[leah]

haha i know, i know. 35 was my limit, though. i needed at least some time to have a life--especially after i started dating josh and had to make the drive to lincoln once a week or every other week.

[leah]

ALSO my former roommate krystal totally worked 40 hrs a week AND was involved in several groups AND a sorority. she kicked ass. sometimes i thought she was definitely on speed . . . but i think it was just 12 pots of coffee a day or something. she is now in med school doing the same kind of B.S. she's awesome.

[Zanchief]

I think it would be better to make schools compete for our children and for our tax dollars. It would also be great if good teachers were paid more than horrible ones.

I really can't think of a worse idea then this. It would be pretty much streamline schools so that kids would only be good at completely subjective grading methods so schools would get more money.

On top of that schools that need more money and more attention would just get less of both because they have more problems.

That is EXACTLY what is going on now.

It would only get worse.

[Drem]

Are we talking about k-12 or higher education?

[ClakarEQ]

Are we talking about k-12 or higher education?

k-12 and then it spun into higher

[Drem]

because i don't think any of the stuff they're talking about happens on a k-12 level. far as i know, what school a kid goes to is determined by where he lives. schools that need money generally get the bonds and grants required to do it as time goes on. teachers earn their money based on seniority and nothing else, like any other normal job. i've only seen one school close down around here in my lifetime so far. but this isn't really a huge city or anything

shifting money around and shit like that won't fix the schools imo. it's just up to the teachers to decide to start teaching relevant material at the appropriate ages. we shouldn't have kids doing multiplication and division til the 4th grade and finally starting basic algebra somewhere near middle school.... it's stupid. among other things, like the fact that every child should learn a second language or pick up a musical instrument in kindergarten or 1st grade, instead of waiting til 5th grade just to play the goddamn recorder. we're making our kids retarded, and ultimately it's just up to us to fix the syllabi of every k-12 class and make school more intensive so kids are actually engaged and want to be there'

now, in college, i agree with most of that stuff... especially if it's sports-related. schools definitely compete for the students and their money etc. etc., and budget doesn't become an issue because of all the financial backing that comes solely from sports... i mean shit, i'm forced to pay for season tickets to every sport as part of my tuition costs. it's fucked-up

[ClakarEQ]

Well I started the post becuase it was k-12 and there is a 25% drop out rate, I thought that seemed really high. I would have thought it was maybe 10% or something at most.

Perhaps I didn't understand the article I linked but it was all high school talk, not higher education that the thread spun into.

[Drem]

yeah, 25% is not good. and that's kinda what i'm talking about. school is so unengaging and boring that kids would rather drop out and go to a community college for a GED or do drugs or something or work as a logger or go to job corps, instead of caring about becoming an astronaut or an engineer or a physicist or something like that. it's sad. and i know, academia's not for everyone, but i think everyone should finish high school, at least, FFS

[Harrison]

If you're of above average intelligence, or more. High school is a flat-out joke. If you can drop out, get your G.E.D. and then head to college at a faster rate, do it.

You're not missing anything and certainly have much more to gain. School is basically free fucking daycare for your kids from k-12. Why raise your kids when they're forced to go somewhere 7 hours a day and do nothing of worth?

[ClakarEQ]

If you're of above average intelligence, or more. High school is a flat-out joke. If you can drop out, get your G.E.D. and then head to college at a faster rate, do it.

You're not missing anything and certainly have much more to gain. School is basically free fucking daycare for your kids from k-12. Why raise your kids when they're forced to go somewhere 7 hours a day and do nothing of worth?

I'm not saying that high school isn't a joke, but I would have to bet that (a guess here) less than 80% of those that drop out of high school get a GED and of those probably 1% go to college

[Tossica]

If you're of above average intelligence, or more. High school is a flat-out joke. If you can drop out, get your G.E.D. and then head to college at a faster rate, do it.

You're not missing anything and certainly have much more to gain. School is basically free fucking daycare for your kids from k-12. Why raise your kids when they're forced to go somewhere 7 hours a day and do nothing of worth?

Although partially true, that's not really a fair statement. You get out of it what you put in as others have already stated. If all you want to do is pass and get your diploma, go ahead and drop out in 9th grade and get your HSED. If you want to go on to a good university, get scholarships, play sports professionally, etc. you really need to not only apply yourself in high school but excel at what you are doing and milk the system for everything it has to offer.

I also recommend nailing as many cheerleaders and danceline girls as possible before dropping out.

[Harrison]

Lol the Army is sending me to Arkansas for two weeks for "classes" to get my G.E.D. before basic. (I never finished the last class because I was frustrated with the boring bullshit MA forces you to go through to get a piece of paper. They wouldn't let me take all the tests in the same day either. Fucking retarded.)

The entire time I'll be in a paid hotel, getting my salary, paid meals, etc.

Talk about a paid fucking vacation. Too bad it's in fucking Arkansas...

To Tossica's ninja post:

Two years community college with a 4.0, transfer out with as many transferrable credits possible. (can be worked out ahead of time if you know where you want to go)

I don't know of many places that wouldn't take a proven student over that of some highschool dipshit.

[Naethyn]

Army? Why?

[Harrison]

Pretty much my best option at the moment. Plus, it's been mulling over in my mind for quite a while now. With my ASVAB score, I can do whatever the fuck I want to. They're all over my nuts.

I tried to get a student loan for EMT-B training. The current state of the economy basically laughed at that idea.

This way I get college credits during AIT, job experience, the whole bit. Plus, I get paid a decent amount while doing so.

[Trielelvan]

That's awesome Harri, though sorry you're going to Arkansas for it.

Is that what you're aiming for once you hit tech school? EMT?

[leah]

ohnoz army that makes me sad

also, re: high school being a joke to people of above-average intelligence+, that is lies. high school was fun and challenging for me, and i ain't stupid :P

[Harrison]

That's awesome Harri, though sorry you're going to Arkansas for it.

Is that what you're aiming for once you hit tech school? EMT?

I'm aiming for communications, seeing as I have a built-in knack for it. I might transfer to active duty, though. So I can be stationed overseas... (hopefully Germany or somewhere interesting)

I'm leaving all of this open though. I will decide at a later date once I see wtf is going on. I get preference over those "holding out" for their specific MOS, which is a major plus. Uptight kids thinking they're there for school holding out for a specific job get the curb if I decide to snatch the position.