namelesstavern.net

Mindia wrote:Or better yet, go kneel down in front of a crucifix of Jesus... but I'll let you and all Catholics in on a little secret... Jesus came down off the cross. There's no need to keep putting Him back up on it again.

Tikker wrote:so, like, aren't you the one with a cross as an avatar, and a pic of jesus on the cross as a sig?

Mindia just got

The cross on the avatar is symbolic. The sig is a reminder of Christ's passion. Catholics nail Jesus up on the cross each and every Mass.

so, you're saying that the catholic's don't use the cross as a symbol?

or, that your use of the images of christ on the cross (that you display many times a day) is somehow different than how the catholics do it?



I don't think so skippy

the sky may be purple in your world, but you have to realize that you're alone over there. feel free to drink the kool-aid tho

Tikker wrote:so, you're saying that the catholic's don't use the cross as a symbol?

or, that your use of the images of christ on the cross (that you display many times a day) is somehow different than how the catholics do it?



I don't think so skippy

the sky may be purple in your world, but you have to realize that you're alone over there. feel free to drink the kool-aid tho

Catholics don't use crosses in their church's... they use Crucifix's. Each and every cross in a Catholic church has an effigy of Jesus glued/nailed to it. The entire production of Mass is about going through the motion of putting Jesus on that cross each and every Sunday. It's totally ridiculous.

My sig is completely different because it represents something completely different. You wouldn't understand because you're an atheist, and you know nothing about the RCC.

hrm
it's funny you say that

I've seen plenty of crosses in catholic churches
shockingly enough, I even have 2 aunts who are catholic nuns, and i've seen plenty of non crucifix crosses in their houses



ps, do you actually even follow any of the tenants of your own church? and if so, can you post which of your fundamental beliefs are optional?

The entire production of Mass is about going through the motion of putting Jesus on that cross each and every Sunday.

Actually, no, it's not. It's not even remotely like that. And before you claim I don't know because I'm an athiest (which I'm not), or that I follow some other faith, remember I was at least nominally a catholic through my teens, as I was dragged to church by my parents, and made to go through the equivalent of sunday school. (it was actually Wednesday nights, but that's neither here nor there) Catholic mass has absolutely nothing to do with that whatsoever. That is a completely inaccurate, ignorant, and moronic thing to claim.

And remember, I don't even LIKE catholicism at this point, I am hardly an ardent defender of a church institution that disgusts me these days. (see: actions of several Bishops with regards to the molesting priests for one reason why)

-Arlos

Mindia wrote:You wouldn't understand because you're an atheist, and you know nothing about the RCC.

Enlighten us, if you would be so kind, please, Mindia. I'm sure my tiny atheist brain will be able to comprehend most of what you say. That is with the use of a dictionary and the internet. I hate to be the ant at your picnic, but I was raised Roman Catholic and have a fair amount of knowledge on the subject.

When you said that statement it reminded me of my son telling me about how an airplane could fly. When I asked him what made it fly, he said "You wouldn't understand, Dad." And left it at that with no reason why.

You constantly remind me of my 8 year old son, Mindia.

By the way, I have been an aircraft mechanic for the last 14 years and know more than my fair share about what and why an aircraft can fly. But, I'm not telling you

ITS A FACT

Catholics are responsible for 90% of all the worlds crimes

Lock them all up I say!!

You're confusing them with minorities in our country.

I can't even get Mindia to admit what's on SDA's website as the baseline of their religion. I don't think we should segue into other things since he's already over his head.

His views and posts are not surprising. Lets AGAIN look at the foundation of his church

17. The Gift of Prophecy:
One of the gifts of the Holy Spirit is prophecy. This gift is an identifying mark of the remnant church and was manifested in the ministry of Ellen. G. White . As the Lord's messenger, her writings are a continuing and authoritative source of truth which provide for the church comfort, guidance, instruction, and correction.

I wonder if Mindia or his pastor has read The Desire of the Ages and The Great Controversy. I'd guess no. A shame they don't even understand their own church.

Let's list their friendly little dogma and beliefs, shall we?

1. the Catholic Church is the Whore of Babylon;
This would explain Mindia's hate and ignorance regarding RC.

2. the pope is the Antichrist;
Somewhat inline with answer 1.

3. Sunday worship will be "the mark of the beast";
Dang, so much for Easter Sunday.

4. there is a future millennium in which the devil will roam the earth while Christians are with Christ in heaven;
No, he doesn't mean Bill Gates.

5. the soul sleeps between death and resurrection;
I wonder if Mindia will answer that he believes in any of these.

6. One must not eat meats considered unclean under the Mosaic Law (many endorse total vegetarianism), and one must avoid "worldly entertainments" (card-playing, dancing, smoking, drinking, reading non-religious books, listening to non-religious music, watching non-religious television, going to the movies, etc.)

You've already admitted your belief in Sola Scripture and Sola Fida, so essentially your life is run according to Ellen G, White, whether you have the wherewithal to see it or not.

So, if you'd care to lie and sin more here then feel free. I'd personally recommend finding a real priest and going to confession ASAP. You'd be amazed at how it can free a troubled soul caught in a cultish web of simplistic evil.

Well, we know he listens to Nickelback, so he's broken that one. He should go listen to STRYPER or something instead! A thornier question is whether or not you'd count Fox News to be religious television. Given how far right they are, and how in bed they are with the Falwellesque camp, he might be OK on that one. Oh, wait, he's admitted to watching CNN. So much for that.

BTW, Lyion, he has, in previous threads, admitted to believing in the whole "soul sleep" concept.

Now, as for YOU, I've yet to see you condemn the bishops who shuffled those molesting priests around, and in any way call for their punishment, or better yet, defrocking and turning over to the secular authorities. (I'd say that what they did amounts to collusion and conspiracy.) While the SDA certainly is a cult, the Catholic church's hands are FAR from clean.

-Arlos

It aggrevates the shit out of me when people say Fox news is "Far right"...

The truth aggravates the shit out of you?

-Arlos

No, it's fucking aggravating because it's not even close to "far right".

It's to the right of course, but that's in comparison to our ridiculously far left media in general.

Catholics are the most aggravating, annoying group of "Christians" on the planet. Most catholics were born into it. You will be VERY hard pressed to find somebody who has studied the various denominations of Christianity and then has decided to follow catholicism... it just doesn't happen that often, if at all. Want the reason for this? Open up the bible and study it. That will be your first clue.

I furthermore find it hilarious and quite fascinating that of all the places on God's green earth, we have the two most educated and knowledgeable religious scholars available to enlighten us, right here on the NT board... Lyion and Arlos.

Arlos wrote:Now, as for YOU, I've yet to see you condemn the bishops who shuffled those molesting priests around, and in any way call for their punishment, or better yet, defrocking and turning over to the secular authorities. (I'd say that what they did amounts to collusion and conspiracy.) While the SDA certainly is a cult, the Catholic church's hands are FAR from clean.

No doubt, and I'll be the first to admit that those who are criminals should pay for their crimes. And they do.

Some of what you are talking about are harmless requests for transfer that are being spun into 'cover ups' . I know you won't admit it, but the media goes absolutely ape shit about any accusation and especially loves to attack religion.

Part of this is learning how to deal with these issues in America, and every organization makes mistakes. The RCC knows it and realizes it has screwed up in the past.

Accusations can be false, and I'd wager many have been. Unfortuantely due process and rights seem to go out the door when religion is involved, or other things the media wishes to judge, whether they are true or not.

But we know Due Process and individual rights for priests don't count since they are automatically guilty....

Mindia, you can't even comprehend your own churches simplistic, small set of rules.

I shall name you Seventeen from now on. I shall look for a suitable 17 title for you.

No doubt, and I'll be the first to admit that those who are criminals should pay for their crimes. And they do.

Some of what you are talking about are harmless requests for transfer that are being spun into 'cover ups' . I know you won't admit it, but the media goes absolutely ape shit about any accusation and especially loves to attack religion.

Part of this is learning how to deal with these issues in America, and every organization makes mistakes. The RCC knows it and realizes it has screwed up in the past.

Lyion, we know absolutely about the case of the Archbishop in Boston, who *KNEW* that a priest he was shuffling from parish to parish was molesting kids, knew it for a fact, and continued to move him around, no warnings, nothing. That's why that archdiocese has had that multi-million dollar lawsuit. Yet that same individual got to conduct a mass AT THE POPE SELECTION MEETINGS. He wasn't reprimanded, hell, he was held up obviously as some sort of paragon as he was given such a prominant position there.

Attacking the RCC for its actions of the time is not attacking religion. It is an incontrovertable fact that Catholic priests were molesting children. It is also a fact that the Church conspired to hide this fact from the parishoners, and protected the priests involved. Many of those priests are no longer with the church. Hooray, congrats, good work. Entirely too late, however.

If the church were TRULY on top of things, the moment they knew what was going on, they should have defrocked the individuals in question and turned them over to the police, along with every iota of evidence they had on the cases. If they'd done this, no one would be attacking the actions of the RCC. But that's not what they did, is it? I wasn't aware that any church should need to "learn how to deal with these issues in America" in order to stop priests from molesting little boys.

And I hate to tell you, "realizing it has screwed up in the past" and "making apologies" doesn't cut it, not when those at the center of the events aren't even disciplined, much less kicked out. Hell, the current pope didn't even make any statements against what was going on until very recently.

My parents are very devout catholics. Both are eucharistic ministers, my dad is the highest rank you can get in the Knights of Columbus, he has taught CCD for many years, and they are both senior staff in the Marriage Encounter program. THEY are disgusted with the RCC over this issue. Not enough to leave the church, but certainly enough to be entirely supportive of those suing the RCC.

-Arlos

the doctrine reads like a bad sci-fi film written when people believed that the earth was the center of the universe.

Arlos you completely missed my point about cover ups. The Cardinal Law situation is not exactly as you are stating it. He made huge mistakes but he is not a criminal.

Law resigned and was moved to a different post. He was not the criminal and while he was inept and he screwed up in the way he allowed for due process and stood by the normal way the church conducted business which wasn't acceptable for what was occuring. There is no doubt things should have been handled much differently, but were not.

Something tells me if your parents are still devout their understanding and discussion regarding this would be similar to mine. Outrage at inaction, but understanding in the need for positive change and addressing things. Not condemnation, as you are wont to do.

Again you are completely missing the point of DUE PROCESS.

As I said, criminals should be punished. Your position is one of hostility towards the clergy and condemnation of 10s of thousands of priests due to the actions of a handful. No, there is not a vast conspiracy, either.

I'm not sure what your point is other than the RCC makes mistakes. So it does and it evolves and corrects them, but that totally tangents from the discussion here.

Mindia wrote:God isn't tolerant of homosexuality or of abortion, genious. He also said "You shall have no other Gods before Me." How hard is that to comprehend? It was pretty easy for me.

76% and dropping...

I still find most of you retarded for picking a religion like you would a car.

Hmmm, this one has the best features and options...I think I'll choose this car.

Plus, I get 1k cashback!

I'm more interested in the reality of the universe, not what a bunch of people wrote in some fucked up book... Not what some slopehead thought sitting under a tree...whatever it may be.

Unfortunately dying is the best way to "figure it out" in one way or another.

I think most people in this country specifically look at religion like it's a magazine subscription. "Ohhhh this one looks good, I'll pick that and go to heaven and get my 10k virgins covered in peanut butter."

HAYZ THIS ONE SEZ I CAN CUM BAK AS A CUTE KITTIE WHEN I DIE IF IM A GUD PERSUN

I will now choose [insert ridiculously stupid belief here]

Mindia wrote:Catholics don't use crosses in their church's... they use Crucifix's.

oh dang, down to 68%

Harrison wrote:No, it's fucking aggravating because it's not even close to "far right".

If you say so.