namelesstavern.net

fact is as a business man myself I go where the money is. No money in alternative fuels= Fuck That Noise

The fact is the area in ANWR that we were drilling was set aside for drilling. You point out what impact standardized drilling will effect to the environment and I might buy it. The changes in drilling now and pre 2000 is night and day. Anyone actually doing some research would know this.

Brin, I agree we need alternative fuels but we also need to break away from these countries like venezuala(sp), Iran, Iraq, Saudi Arabia, United Amerites...etc etc. The only way to do this is by telling these people "Fuck you We are drilling our own oil" once we are less dependant on foriegn market we will see something this country needs, and thats self reliance, and self respect. You dont think there was a great cheer from the middle east when the Senate shot this down?



You will most likely see an increase in jobs(something the dems bitch about) we will see economy start to pick up a little more. Once we are self sufficient we can start working on weening away from the oil.

I do agree with Ralf any research we do will be a while from now. Till then we have to do what we can to improve our condition here in the US. Even if it means becoming isolationists of a sort.

How about this Brin? We establish safe modern refineries in the US, preferrably onsone of the old military bases we have sitting empty. Once they are funstional we start refining our own oil, This in turn brings in new jobs for the people in the surrounding areas. Drilling commences in ANWR. The money we save on ANWR drilling and refining our own oil, plus taxes from US produced gas goes to finding alternative means of fuel, as well as possible conversion systems for exsisting cars. Perhaps finding a fuel source we can use in exsisting cars without conversion. Once that is done we have the refineries start switching over one by one to the new alternative fuel. We still have self reliance, we still have jobs for those working in these new refineries.


Ok not the best situation but better than anything brought up.

i'd go for that situation minus the ANWR drilling

I want to drill for oil in the ocean near lots of endangered whales and cute dolphins. I don't give a shit . We should be drilling everywhere.

How about off the coast of florida? They have more oil in that gulf then ANWR, Texas and Iraq combined. Florida has been bottlenecked for awhile.

Fact is Ocean drilling is actually good for the enviornment since the Oil rigs create reefs for fish and sealife. As it stands Oil drilling in the Oceans has no negative impacts on wildlife. We can start drilling there but the fact is we need to Drill in ANWR for atleast two years to get revenue up to the point we can start building the oil rigs we need there.

Enviornmental impact in ANWR is and will be non exsistent. The oil is drilled during the 3 months of the year that most of the wildlife migrates to warmer weather.

Look I understand why you are not wanting drilling in ANWR, frankly it is admirable but the fact of the matter is that this was suggested 12 years ago and the liberals and most of the enviornemtnalists got behind it. What has vchanged since then? We have improved our abilities for both vertical and horizontal drilling we have reduced the impact on the wildlife to almost nonexsistent except for maybe a new place for the White wolves up there to hike their legs on. Well how about the political spectrum? 12 years ago it was shot down by the same people promoting the drilling now. 5 years from now if we get democratic president in will the enviornmentalists back them like they did before?

Fact is we need to become independant from other countries. We need to bring back jobs into this country, we need alot of things done. Neither side is doing their job. Oil is just one factor that needs addressed. I cant remeber who suggested the bio desil. I am all for it but we need to step away from the dependancy and start keeping our cash in the US instead of giving it to sand jockeys.

kaharthemad wrote:Fact is Ocean drilling is actually good for the enviornment since the Oil rigs create reefs for fish and sealife.

DIB!

brinstar wrote:why's that?

name five big companies that make all their money from non-petroleum energy sources.

That's a fallacious argument and you know it. It's akin to claiming that there's no money in FTL travel or cold fusion, simply because no major companies earn 100% of their income from either technology. Any viable alternative energy source would be worth trillions of dollars to the pioneers who field it first.

This thread makes me wants to take a hot steamy piss down some environmentalist's throats.

xaoshaen wrote:Any viable alternative energy source would be worth trillions of dollars to the pioneers who field it first.

right

but there is a lag time between "researching a viable alternative energy source" and "pioneering a viable alternative energy source" during which lots and lots of money will be lost

that's what i mean when i say "there's no money in it" -- no one wants to stick their neck out far enough to jump that gap, and as long as it's cheaper or more profitable to pull oil out of the ground, no one will.

Like private space travel? Or gov't space travel? No money in that either. Still gets spent. We piss away billions on NASA for an extremely limited return, whether it's Velcro patents or scientific discovery. Why not alternative fuel?

captain_insano wrote:This thread makes me wants to take a hot steamy piss down some environmentalist's throats.

They could just wait for the coldest month of the year and start drilling. Would be fun watching the hippies staging sit-ins in 40 below(Celsius) weather.

Zanchief Returns wrote:

captain_insano wrote:This thread makes me wants to take a hot steamy piss down some environmentalist's throats.

They could just wait for the coldest month of the year and start drilling. Would be fun watching the hippies staging sit-ins in 40 below(Celsius) weather.

Zanchief Returns wrote:

captain_insano wrote:This thread makes me wants to take a hot steamy piss down some environmentalist's throats.

They could just wait for the coldest month of the year and start drilling. Would be fun watching the hippies staging sit-ins in 40 below(Celsius) weather.

well actually that is when the proposed drilling would be..3 months a year when the place they are drilling looks like a parking lot at a bowling alley.

The are they set up for drilling is pretty much a shale and limestone area. not too conducive(sp) to indeginous life.

We could remove a huge source of oil dependency, right now, today, with negligable capital outlay by setting up industrial hemp plantations and using it to produce biodiesel. Every drop of diesel fuel we use in the entire US could be replaced by biodiesel from hemp crops. Now, how much would no longer needing to import a single drop of diesel cut down on our forieng oil dependency, hmmm?

Not to mention, only the seeds of the hemp plants would be used in biodiesel production. The rest of the plant could be sold for its fiber for use in producing paper, thus reducing logging pressure on our forests. It could also be used for animal feed, clothing, rope, or a myriad of other uses. Also, hemp requires no pesticides, no fertilizers, and minimal irrigation.

Personally, I far far prefer this option than drilling in ANWR. It requires no research, no new technology, and grown on large enough plantations to achieve economy of scale, the fuel produced would be price-competitive with petro-diesel, and likely would end up being even cheaper.

-Arlos

arlos wrote:We could remove a huge source of oil dependency, right now, today, with negligable capital outlay by setting up industrial hemp plantations and using it to produce biodiesel. Every drop of diesel fuel we use in the entire US could be replaced by biodiesel from hemp crops. Now, how much would no longer needing to import a single drop of diesel cut down on our forieng oil dependency, hmmm?

Not to mention, only the seeds of the hemp plants would be used in biodiesel production. The rest of the plant could be sold for its fiber for use in producing paper, thus reducing logging pressure on our forests. It could also be used for animal feed, clothing, rope, or a myriad of other uses. Also, hemp requires no pesticides, no fertilizers, and minimal irrigation.

Personally, I far far prefer this option than drilling in ANWR. It requires no research, no new technology, and grown on large enough plantations to achieve economy of scale, the fuel produced would be price-competitive with petro-diesel, and likely would end up being even cheaper.

-Arlos

and every fucking hippy within a 500 mile radius without a clue would be breaking into the place to try and smoke it.

Zanchief Returns wrote:

captain_insano wrote:This thread makes me wants to take a hot steamy piss down some environmentalist's throats.

They could just wait for the coldest month of the year and start drilling. Would be fun watching the hippies staging sit-ins in 40 below(Celsius) weather.

haha... hippie-cicles. I bet they wouldn't smell so bad if they were frozen.

kaharthemad wrote:and every fucking hippy within a 500 mile radius without a clue would be breaking into the place to try and smoke it.

that would drop off pretty quickly once they realize there's no THC in industrial hemp