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Zanchief wrote:Shit, that's a good deal. I don't have to be nice or do good deeds or treat anyone with respect? I just have to believe in God to get into heaven and my hooker murder quotas aren't even gonna dip?

As sick as that sounds, yes, by accepting Christ you are forgiven for all sins past, present, and future; it's the beauty of grace. Though by accepting Christ most feel the conviction of His Spirit not to perform those misdeeds any more. It's all a learning process and you really find yourself wanting to become a better person just to repay such a beautiful gift.

Buddism offers salvation but in a different sort of way. The basis of Buddism is to seek enlightenment. This may not occur right away, but Buddist also believe in reincarnation. Reincarnation in its own is eternal life, so how can you say nothing is offered?

lyion wrote:

Mindia wrote:
It offers no salvation! I wasn't picking on it, trolling, or being a smartass. Buddhism's basic premises (in so many words) are to be a good person, treat others as you would like to be treated, etc. etc. etc. but it offers NO SALVATION of eternal life such as in Christianity.

Ironically you highlighted the basic premise of Christianity, sans the evangelical bent that turns so many away. If you truly understood Christianity you would not be promoting it as some bizarre after death happiness, but the path to enlightenment here, which is very similar to Buddhism. Alas, you do not really understand it.

I have no 'backup' religion. When I lost my faith before I reverted to Agnosticism, if that somewhat answers the question.

This thread has just achieved the status of "unbelievable." Don't try to argue Christianity with me, boy. I fully understand Christianity. Enlightenment in Buddhism has nothing to do with an after death 'everlasting life' as in Christianity. THat is something you obviously do not understand. Enlightenment is a state of achievement here on earth.

*sigh*

You don't fully understand christianity if you make a comment about how cool it is to have an avatar that knocks someone elses happiness just because you disagree with it

You don't fully understand christianity if you can't accept that other religions, though they might not be yours, are still religion and believing in a higher power and they are therefore no lower than you on the God totem pole.

You don't fully understand christianity if you can't be accepting and open minded to other people's faiths

You don't fully understand christianity if you're hypocritical and judgmental of anyone who isn't yourself or firmly believes everything you do

What I never understood is this:

If a christian believes in heaven and hell, and that all non believers in god go to hell, where do buddhists, etc go? They believe in a true superior being that guides them through good and bad, but in a christians world, do they go to hell? Because they obviously don't end up in Hell in their world as they don't believe in it

Once you get past all the detailed mumbo jumbo.. it's just a way of living which is very basic and has more similarities than people realize - there's no right and wrong for what you believe in, it's just a matter of being a good-hearted person with certain values shaped to what you believe in

Mindia wrote:LOL Do you know anything about Buddhism Almegest? It offers no salvation! I wasn't picking on it, trolling, or being a smartass. Buddhism's basic premises (in so many words) are to be a good person, treat others as you would like to be treated, etc. etc. etc. but it offers NO SALVATION of eternal life such as in Christianity.

So only do something if there's something in it for you. Got it, sir.

Almegest Victory wrote:Hi, I'm going to knock an entire cultures religion, because I'm a firm believer that <i>if you aren't Christian or Catholic</i>, that you're going to burn in hell!

That's like saying "if you aren't a human being or a woman." I think you mean Protestant and Catholic.

I fully understand Christianity.

As a subject of study, I doubt there are any, or only very few, who fully understand christianity. You could have the bible memorized and still be missing aspects of it. As much as I diss it, there is much more to it than meets the eye. And you don't strike me as the kind of spiritual spelunker who'd find such things.

This is posted on my fridge.

ISLAM

No one of you is a believer until you desire for your neighbour that which you desire for yourself.

BUDDHISM

Treat all creatures as you would like to be treated.

CONFUCIANISM

Do not do to others what you do not want them to do to you

HINDUISM

This is the essence of morality: Do not do to others which if done to you would cause you pain

CHRISTIANITY

Whatever you wish that others do to you, do so to them.

SIKHISM

Do as you desire goodness for yourself as you cannot expect tasty fruits if you sow thorny trees.

BAHÁ’Í FAITH

If your eyes be turned towards justice choose for your neighbour that which you would choose for yourself.

JUDAISM

What is hateful to you, do not do to your neighbour - that is the basic law, all the rest is commentary.

JAINAISM

A human being should wonder about treating all creatures as he (or she) himself (or herself) would like to be treated.

Zoroastrianism

Whatever is disagreeable to yourself do not do unto others.

I like Zoroastrianism. In that religion, it's a cardinal sin to be a boring person because you are squandering the gift of life.

I would vote Zen Buddhism. It's the only religion I've found that preaches kindness <i>and</i> doesn't make you feel horrible about yourself.

Zoroastrianism was big before Islam started wiping it out. It used to be huge in Iran and it still has a lot of followers here from those who came during the Islamic Revolution.

A lot of scholars believe that Judaism/Christianity were inspired by Zoroastrianism, since it is an older monotheistic religion with many similar <and not so similar> traditions.

Early Christianity also stole a lot from the cult of Mithras, one of the various sun gods. It was basically a monotheistic religion, and was very popular, so rather than try and eradicate it, the early christians co-opted many of its holy days and rituals. That's why Christmas is on December 25th. Was originally the Feast of Mithras, the christians just took the day, renamed it, to make it easier to get converts, as they wouldn't have to change their practices, just the name of which god they were praying to.

-Arlos

I don't believe in religion itself.

You guys make it sound like a fucking magazine to subscribe to for the free mug.

Gypsiyee wrote:You don't fully understand christianity if you can't accept that other religions, though they might not be yours, are still religion and believing in a higher power and they are therefore no lower than you on the God totem pole.

The Bible is actually pretty clear on this one:

Thou shalt not have any other gods before me.
The Lord thy God is a jealous god.
I am the way, the truth and the light. No man cometh unto the Father save by me

You don't fully understand christianity if you can't be accepting and open minded to other people's faiths

"I am the way, the truth and the light. No man cometh unto my father save by me". Christianity is not about tolerating other faiths. Now, the New Testament doesn't mandate a slaughter of the unbelievers, but it's quite clear that other faiths are a path to eternal damnation.

If a christian believes in heaven and hell, and that all non believers in god go to hell, where do buddhists, etc go? They believe in a true superior being that guides them through good and bad, but in a christians world, do they go to hell? Because they obviously don't end up in Hell in their world as they don't believe in it

According to Christianity, Buddhists go to hell. They do not worship God, and have not accepted Christ's salvation.

Once you get past all the detailed mumbo jumbo.. it's just a way of living which is very basic and has more similarities than people realize - there's no right and wrong for what you believe in, it's just a matter of being a good-hearted person with certain values shaped to what you believe in

I'm assuming you're referring to Buddhism, but for a Christian right and wrong are absolutes, and being good-hearted is, in and of itself, worthless. Personal righteousness is as "filthy rags" in the eyes of God, and salvation comes only through repentance and acceptance of grace.

They go to your Hell. I dont believe in Hell, therefore I will not be going there. Just because it is something you believe in, doesnt mean it is the correct thing. It's just something you believe in.

Darcler wrote:They go to your Hell. I dont believe in Hell, therefore I will not be going there. Just because it is something you believe in, doesnt mean it is the correct thing. It's just something you believe in.

That depends. If Christians are right... you're going to their Hell because you don't believe. Reality doesn't give a rat's ass whether or not you believe in it. It just goes ahead and happens anyways. If Christian beliefs happen to be a reality, you're hosed.

Good thing its a total crock then.

mofish wrote:Good thing its a total crock then.

Still waiting for that proof of nonexistence.

Don't forget some believe in Baptism of Desire, Xao. It's a contested issue in Catholicism

lyion wrote:Don't forget some believe in Baptism of Desire, Xao. It's a contested issue in Catholicism

I'm not particularly well-versed inCatholic dogma, but as far as I understand it, the Baptism of Desire debate largely revolves around mechanics: do you need to be dipped under the water, or is acknowledging Jesus Christ as your lord and savior sufficient?

mofish wrote:Good thing its a total crock then.

Your arrogance is astounding.

would stay same

xaoshaen wrote:

mofish wrote:Good thing its a total crock then.

Still waiting for that proof of nonexistence.

I dont need to furnish proof of nonexistence.

You, however, need to furnish proof of existence, its your religion. Only been waiting about 2 thousand years, not enough time?

Harrison wrote:

mofish wrote:Good thing its a total crock then.

Your arrogance is astounding.

Your weak replies are boring. Form some opinions before you post.

mofish wrote:

xaoshaen wrote:

mofish wrote:Good thing its a total crock then.

Still waiting for that proof of nonexistence.

I dont need to furnish proof of nonexistence.

So, we can take the following statement as you speaking through your anal orifice then?

mofish wrote:Yes, I think I can easily say that Yahweh obviously doesnt exist. And my morality and sense of right and wrong stem from this tooth fairy, this biblical santa clause? No, they dont.

You, however, need to furnish proof of existence, its your religion. Only been waiting about 2 thousand years, not enough time?

Wow, when did I become Jewish? The people that know me would be shocked to here about this. I'm kinda bummed that I missed my own Bar Mitzvah.

I have never so much as expressed a religious preference on this board. All I've done is point out that your arguments don't pass muster. Don't blame me because you haven't thought your theology all the way through.

So, youre telling me that my morality comes from a god. I dont care which god youre talking about. Please then, enlighten me as to your religion.

Let me rephrase for the literalists. I can say, with as much certainty as I can say about anything, that Yahweh, the god of the OT, NT, Book of Mormon, what have you, does not exist. People claim he exists. People claim he has direct influence over my life, and the decisions I make and how I make them. Yet there is zero evidence for this.

It isnt my responsibility to prove he doesnt exist. If that was the way it worked, why dont you believe in the tooth fairy? Im pretty sure you cant prove she doesnt exist.