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WASHINGTON - The Senate voted Wednesday to divert some of the money President Bush requested for the war in Iraq to instead increase patrols against illegal immigrants on the nation's borders and provide the Coast Guard with new boats and helicopters. An amendment was adopted, 59-39, to cut Bush's Iraq request by $1.9 billion to pay for new aircraft, patrol boats and other vehicles, as well as border checkpoints and a fence along the Mexico border crossing near San Diego.

You know, maybe it's just me, but I REALLY don't understand the anti-immigrant furor that's going on these days, and why there's such resistance to offering them citizenship. I mean, it just destroyed the country when Reagan gave them amnesty in '86, right?

What ever happened to "Give me your tired, your poor, your huddled masses"?

-Arlos

It's about coming here legally, Arlos. It has nothing to do with hatred of Mexicans, or anything else. I'm just glad to see that something is finally being done about it. New immigrants are going to be issued a special card that has a unique ID# on it. If any employer hires an immigrant, that employer has to make a copy of this new ID card. If he fails to produce this record on a random check, it's jail time for him, and his operation will be shut down. We needed this YEARS ago. Part of the problem, are the scumbag employers that hire the illegals. Well, now they're going to be spanked HARD for it, and justifiably so. And also, if you knew how bad illegals screwed up the job market in the skilled trades you'd understand how badly we need this.

arlos wrote:You know, maybe it's just me, but I REALLY don't understand the anti-immigrant furor that's going on these days, and why there's such resistance to offering them citizenship. I mean, it just destroyed the country when Reagan gave them amnesty in '86, right?

What ever happened to "Give me your tired, your poor, your huddled masses"?

-Arlos

I personally have no problem with naturalizng, grandfathering, the illegals that are here already. But the flow needs to stop. They start making a real effort to bust companies hiring them and itll help.

Well, my point is, why make it illegal for them to immigrate, especially if they have work, even though it be farmwork or something like gardening, waiting for them? I dunno, I just see it as an abrogation of some of the original intent of this country back to the time of the Founding Fathers: to be the place where ANYONE could go to for a chance at a better life, or to escape tyranny or poverty where they came from. Locking people out just strikes me as running counter to that intent.

Also, as I said, since we've seen at least one case in the relatively recent past where there was no harm done with just telling all the people here illegally "OK, you can stay, here's how to apply for citizenship", why the resistance to doing it again?

-Arlos

If you want to become a citizen, you fill out all the necessary paperwork, do the interviews, take the civics classes, take a couple exams, and do it the legal way... the right way. My parents did that when they immigrated from Germany. That's the correct way for an immigrant to become a citizen, not by burrowing through holes in the ground, or jumping fences, or hiding in the framework of a vehicle. And I do have a problem with "grandfathering-in" the ones that are here illegally already. That makes no sense at all. The government needs to round them all up and ship them back, and make them go through the proper immigration channels.

No one is saying stop the immigration into the US. They are saying, stop the massive, illegal immigration.

Yes, they are taking jobs from Americans. My great friend got laid off from a landscaping company after Katrina because the owner hired a gaggle of illegals.

I even read an article where Mexico is now having illegals coming in from further south to take jobs that are open because the Mexicans that had those jobs are illegally immigrating to the US.

By the way, what do you thin Mexico would do in this situation? If US citizens were attempting to flood Mexico? Do you think there would be huge rallies sympathizing with our plights? Of course not.

arlos wrote:Well, my point is, why make it illegal for them to immigrate, especially if they have work, even though it be farmwork or something like gardening, waiting for them? I dunno, I just see it as an abrogation of some of the original intent of this country back to the time of the Founding Fathers: to be the place where ANYONE could go to for a chance at a better life, or to escape tyranny or poverty where they came from. Locking people out just strikes me as running counter to that intent.

Also, as I said, since we've seen at least one case in the relatively recent past where there was no harm done with just telling all the people here illegally "OK, you can stay, here's how to apply for citizenship", why the resistance to doing it again?

-Arlos

Because they are criminals. If you hopped the fence to get into America, you committed a crime. When you commit a crime, you're a criminal. You want to change the laws now too to protect criminals??? If I hopped the fence to get into Disneyland, should the security guards let me stay there because I made it in?

Mindia wrote:If you want to become a citizen, you fill out all the necessary paperwork, do the interviews, take the civics classes, take a couple exams, and do it the legal way... the right way. My parents did that when they immigrated from Germany. That's the correct way for an immigrant to become a citizen, not by burrowing through holes in the ground, or jumping fences, or hiding in the framework of a vehicle. And I do have a problem with "grandfathering-in" the ones that are here illegally already. That makes no sense at all. The government needs to round them all up and ship them back, and make them go through the proper immigration channels.

You are severly dellusional if you think this will ever happen, to send all the ones here that are illegal already is estimated to cost $400 billion, which would rival the cost of the iraq war.

If you want to become a citizen, you fill out all the necessary paperwork, do the interviews, take the civics classes, take a couple exams, and do it the legal way... the right way. My parents did that when they immigrated from Germany.

I knew you were the demon spawn of Nazis, it was only a matter of time before it came out.

DESX wrote:

Mindia wrote:If you want to become a citizen, you fill out all the necessary paperwork, do the interviews, take the civics classes, take a couple exams, and do it the legal way... the right way. My parents did that when they immigrated from Germany. That's the correct way for an immigrant to become a citizen, not by burrowing through holes in the ground, or jumping fences, or hiding in the framework of a vehicle. And I do have a problem with "grandfathering-in" the ones that are here illegally already. That makes no sense at all. The government needs to round them all up and ship them back, and make them go through the proper immigration channels.

You are severly dellusional if you think this will ever happen, to send all the ones here that are illegal already is estimated to cost $400 billion, which would rival the cost of the iraq war.

I'd be more than happy, and willing, to pay an extra tax to get rid of these annoyances.

Ginzburgh wrote:

If you want to become a citizen, you fill out all the necessary paperwork, do the interviews, take the civics classes, take a couple exams, and do it the legal way... the right way. My parents did that when they immigrated from Germany.

I knew you were the demon spawn of Nazis, it was only a matter of time before it came out.

Stop trolling, thanks.

See, where you see annoyances, people with functional brains see human beings.

You really should see someone about that sociopathy.

Mindia wrote:

DESX wrote:

Mindia wrote:If you want to become a citizen, you fill out all the necessary paperwork, do the interviews, take the civics classes, take a couple exams, and do it the legal way... the right way. My parents did that when they immigrated from Germany. That's the correct way for an immigrant to become a citizen, not by burrowing through holes in the ground, or jumping fences, or hiding in the framework of a vehicle. And I do have a problem with "grandfathering-in" the ones that are here illegally already. That makes no sense at all. The government needs to round them all up and ship them back, and make them go through the proper immigration channels.

You are severly dellusional if you think this will ever happen, to send all the ones here that are illegal already is estimated to cost $400 billion, which would rival the cost of the iraq war.

I'd be more than happy, and willing, to pay an extra tax to get rid of these annoyances.

I wouldn't.

Stop trolling, thanks.

Stoping whining Nazi.

mofish wrote:See, where you see annoyances, people with functional brains see human beings.

You really should see someone about that sociopathy.

Once again, if they come here legally, they will not be viewed as annoyances anymore. Most of the country thinks the same way as I do about them. Why do you think there's such a strong push to get them out?

Ginzburgh wrote:

Stop trolling, thanks.

Stoping whining Nazi.

Oh stop, you're really hurting my feelings

I think you still missed my point to some extent: I don't think it necessarily *SHOULD* be illegal for these people to immigrate. The only reason they're doing so illegally is the bar is so high these days to do so legally, and there's quotas on how many people can and cannot enter. I still say that the whole concept of locking people out who want to become Americans is counter to the initial intent of this country. Remember what's on the statue of Liberty, as I said before: "Give me your tired, your poor, your huddled masses"... If people have to jump through 87 hoops, and there's quotas on how many can come in, the people who do make it aren't exactly poor or part of the huddled masses...

-Arlos

Mindia wrote:

mofish wrote:See, where you see annoyances, people with functional brains see human beings.

You really should see someone about that sociopathy.

Once again, if they come here legally, they will not be viewed as annoyances anymore. Most of the country thinks the same way as I do about them. Why do you think there's such a strong push to get them out?

A strong push? By who, the minutemen?

DESX wrote:

Mindia wrote:

mofish wrote:See, where you see annoyances, people with functional brains see human beings.

You really should see someone about that sociopathy.

Once again, if they come here legally, they will not be viewed as annoyances anymore. Most of the country thinks the same way as I do about them. Why do you think there's such a strong push to get them out?

A strong push? By who, the minutemen?

By the majority of Americans.

Mindia wrote:

DESX wrote:

Mindia wrote:

mofish wrote:See, where you see annoyances, people with functional brains see human beings.

You really should see someone about that sociopathy.

Once again, if they come here legally, they will not be viewed as annoyances anymore. Most of the country thinks the same way as I do about them. Why do you think there's such a strong push to get them out?

A strong push? By who, the minutemen?

By the majority of Americans.

......? where

arlos wrote:I think you still missed my point to some extent: I don't think it necessarily *SHOULD* be illegal for these people to immigrate. The only reason they're doing so illegally is the bar is so high these days to do so legally, and there's quotas on how many people can and cannot enter. I still say that the whole concept of locking people out who want to become Americans is counter to the initial intent of this country. Remember what's on the statue of Liberty, as I said before: "Give me your tired, your poor, your huddled masses"... If people have to jump through 87 hoops, and there's quotas on how many can come in, the people who do make it aren't exactly poor or part of the huddled masses...

-Arlos

How about we help Mexico set up a straight government. Mexico is rich with resources. They have plenty of oil underground, prime coastal real estate, hard-working people, etc. Their problem is their government. Why not help them improve their economy and government so that they will be proud to stay in their own county and make a decent wage?

DESX wrote:

Mindia wrote:

DESX wrote:

Mindia wrote:

mofish wrote:See, where you see annoyances, people with functional brains see human beings.

You really should see someone about that sociopathy.

Once again, if they come here legally, they will not be viewed as annoyances anymore. Most of the country thinks the same way as I do about them. Why do you think there's such a strong push to get them out?

A strong push? By who, the minutemen?

By the majority of Americans.

......? where

Dude, are you serious? Do you watch the news?

Mindia wrote:

DESX wrote:

Mindia wrote:

DESX wrote:

Mindia wrote:

mofish wrote:See, where you see annoyances, people with functional brains see human beings.

You really should see someone about that sociopathy.

Once again, if they come here legally, they will not be viewed as annoyances anymore. Most of the country thinks the same way as I do about them. Why do you think there's such a strong push to get them out?

A strong push? By who, the minutemen?

By the majority of Americans.

......? where

Dude, are you serious? Do you watch the news?

Yes like I said by the minutemen.

Edit: whoops and by the neo nazi's.

Actually, a recent Time Magazine poll just stated that 47% of Americans want "all illegals deported" and 49% said no. Well, if you look at 10 different polls you'll get 10 different results. With so many Americans in favor of deporting the illegals it is prompting at least some adverse action to the illegal immigrant problem. Whether it's denying them free health care and other benefits such as driver's licenses, and doing things like strenghtening the borders, etc.