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Is it just me and maybe where I'm at in game level/progression wise, or are guilds and player mentality a lot more loose compared to EQ. I can generally peg the former EQ players based on conversation, and how they act playstyle wise. It just seems to me there is a very different mindset in general among the majority of the player base. This is not so much a rant since I see both negative and positive aspects, but I was curious if it was similar in the higher end game.

Most definetly. Aryylas has called me on this several times when I start giving commands in a very EQ hardcore raid style. He has to remind me that this is a whole different type of game and where it was seen as good leadership in EQ to be agressive and decisive and chew the shit out of people who fucked up, you look like a bitch when you do it in WoW. Thankfully people like Zanathar are good enough to understand where I am coming from and not be offended and forgive me when I go crazy

I have definitely noticed a different "player attitude" in WoW over EQ. Even those people I know that played EQ just seem to be more selfish, less innovative, less skilled... it's kind of disheartening.

For example, someone that I know that played EQ very very well has problems with agro management (can't seem to understand that keeping agro on the tank is the entire group's responsibility), bad pulls, etc.

Maybe the lack of a real death penalty has made people more lax in their approach.

As far as guild loyalty goes, the game is so new and guilds are still vieing for position and respect - there will be a fair amount of hopping going on till the strata form on each server.

Maybe that's not the point of your post - just some observations of my own.

I pretty much agree

WoW is a haven for clueless, skill less fucktards, and there just aren't a lot of good players out there



I've not run into a single good player that WASN'T an ex EQ'er

the lack of death penalty just makes zerging a viable strategy

Heh, of course the folks who are playing WoW as their first MMO aren't going to be as adept as the EQ veterans. Anyone remember their first Naggy raid (second, or third in some cases)? Trying to get everyone buffed, logged to chat, and still alert was like herding cats.

I've met plenty of bright folks who have just jumped into WoW, both in the Beta and at release, who just need a bit of seasoning so they're not FNGs. When I actually care about the result, I still run groups in the same dictatorial fashion I used in EQ, and it still gets results (even if one of the results is me ending up on an ignore list...)

You folks are giving the EQ general population way too much credit as well. Some of you were in supportive guilds, others must simply have soloed a lot, because there were several metric assloads of utterly inept players on the Nameless alone. Having been in family guilds, uber guilds, nominally cnotrlled chaotic guilds, and unguilded (as a 60 monk with 0 AAs in PoP to boot), I've grouped with pretty much the entire spectrum of players on the Nameless: as a collective, they had nothing on the WoW players you're bitching about. At least with the nominal death penalty in WoW, it's not as painful gather the data that puts one of them on the List.

The problem tho, is that the lack of death penalty doesn't teach them to stop sucking, or frustrate them enough to quit


it's just one more excuse to have a smoke, take a dump, have a giggle, whatever

Intelligent people are capable of learning without negative stimuli. I'd just as soon not group with the mouthbreathers anyway.

What i hate the absolute most, and i get pissed off sometimes about it, which is sad, is the 12 year old faggots that just came from diablo 2 and think it's a fregin playground. They sit in general and /yell cussing all over, ninja looting, stealing chests, being little homos. Bugs the shit out of me. I don't know how many times i've run into skilless fucktards that can barely understand what the fuck i'm talking about when i say add, or sap'ing monk, or when explaining loot rules.

That's why i stick to guild groups.

Oh and the no talent losers that farm azshara all day. Lamers.

Yeah for instance Jirig sucks ALOT at WoW.

I guess he was SUPPOSE to be good at EQ or something.

I've never grouped with people outside of my guild, I don't talk to people outside of my guild, as far as I'm concerned, if they aren't in my guild they are a 12 year old asian boy who just logged off of starcraft for the first time in 6 years that should be avoided like the plague.

i agree . I noticed a shit load of people that are just terrible players. I've 2 boxed and 3 boxed chars better then some people but then again i could do that in EQ as well. I'm leading 20-30 person raids in upper spires for my guild now and being 90% RL friends have to hold off really hard from going into EQ raid leader nazi mode where stupidity is ridiculed heh.

Ginzburgh wrote:Yeah for instance Jirig sucks ALOT at WoW.

I guess he was SUPPOSE to be good at EQ or something.

Hey what the fuck, Chuck.

xaoshaen wrote:Intelligent people are capable of learning without negative stimuli. I'd just as soon not group with the mouthbreathers anyway.

well, a lot of intelligent people must be playing a different game than


Cause they're definately outnumbered 37508972357801750148514:1 in WoW

tikker.. GWs hehe

Tikker wrote:

xaoshaen wrote:Intelligent people are capable of learning without negative stimuli. I'd just as soon not group with the mouthbreathers anyway.

well, a lot of intelligent people must be playing a different game than


Cause they're definately outnumbered 37508972357801750148514:1 in WoW

They were definitely outnumbered 37508972357801750148514:1 in EQ as well. Life lesson 137: the world is full of stupid people.

The EQ high level community was a bit tighter, and way more skillful.

If you sucked in EQ, you didn't level as death has consequences. Death in WOW is meaningless so even if you have a 10 death day, you can still level easily.

I just group mainly with guildy's

95% of them are former eq players from nameless/povar/tarew and other servers, or beta testers

I've been lucky that i havent grouped with any incapable players.

You'll notice most of the noobs and untalented EQ players from our server decided to play Alliance.

Lyion wrote:The EQ high level community was a bit tighter, and way more skillful.

If you sucked in EQ, you didn't level as death has consequences. Death in WOW is meaningless so even if you have a 10 death day, you can still level easily.

Sorry, Lyion, but... bullshit. Particularly once Planes of Power went live, the unwashed masses infested pickup groups far and wide. The problem actually goes as far back as Kunark, when outdoor zones with high exp modifiers replaced dungeons as popular levelling spots. EQ's death penalty slowed the rise of the morons, but was largely mitigated by the low risk of death. The graveyards and ease of travel in PoP pretty much rendered death penalties moot, particularly at 65.

I can't count the number of times I did a pickup LDoN group where the monk couldn't split two casters without dying, the warrior couldn't pull aggro off a beastlord meleeing, the necro thought he would go ahead and fear kite, the cleric spammed blast heals for 5 minutes and whined about being out of mana, the druid nuked right away and exploded on impact... the list goes on and on.

SoL and later expansions are not used when discussions of skill in EQ come up. The skilled left or fucked around after that piece of shit expansion was released.

What Lyion is referring to is the days of real EQ, when the high level crowd in fact were skilled and were not so pussified that they required eliminating hell levels, massive ZEM for noobie zones, gifts of raid level gear through retarded dungeons (LDoN) and graveyards. EQ players who started after 2002 were in fact pussies.

I have noticed a fair number of noobs WoW players, I tend not to group but the few I have had seemed to be full of people just randomly running around. Everyone was just grabbing teh first mob they saw. Was really disheartening. The major difference was that if you did that in EQ you would wipe where as in WoW you might actually survive for a while. Then of course with no real penalty for dieing, they do not learn to work as a team rather then a group of 5 invididuals.

Thankfully, the mojority of the true noobs went with alliance (everyone always wants to be the good guy for some reason).

For me, I prefer guild groups, they are considerably more skilled and far more successful.

I know most i know picked alliance simply because they didnt wanna play ugly characters.

Oh I forgot this is Barbie's Cut-n-Paste dressup!

I am pretty

Personally I think my char looks great, though that was not a determining factor in my choice.