Is WOW fucked long term?

[Tikker]

Its fast food and packaged for the ADD crowd.

If you think sitting in a corner killing the same 8 MOBs over and over and over is a challenge, then I pity you. If you think that because someone could sit there and grind those 8 MOBs for hours means they have a better attention span, then I pity you. If you think that because it took months to grind enough iterations of those 8 MOBs to get to level 50 (or 60, 65, 70 whatever) that the game was better for it, then I pity you.

You just don't get it. A game is supposed to be fun... not work. EQ was work - it was hours upon hours of grinding for a level. It was hours and hours of camping for a spawn... only for it to not drop what you needed. It was hours upon endlessly stupid hours of killing green-con spiders (or rats, or whatever) for the 1500 silks you needed to skill up your tradeskills. It was hours upon hours of killing literally thousands of green-con mobs for faction to do a quest. YOU CALL THAT "BETTER"?

I pity you.

quoting this because it's true

Only reason people look back so fondly on EQ was because it was their first large-scale successful mmorpg, so they're using it as some sort of benchmark to compare WoW to.

WoW is a far, far superior game to EQ. However if you're the type of person who's into D&D roleplaying shit then I can imagine you'd like EQ better.

My guild has done most of the higher-end content, we've cleared MC up to Majordomo, killed Onyxia, killed Azuregos, killed Kazzak, and doing all of those were way more fun than doing anything I've done in EQ. And I look forward to doing them some more.

If you're having problems forming any type of community then grow a personality and become friends with people, I've met a shitload of cool people in the game.

Everything in WoW is superior to EQ, other than patching and server issues heh.

You like WoW better because you were just a gimp EQ player who didn't get to do a lot of the raiding, and now that you get to see the top end you're comparing top end WoW raiding, to being a gimp hanger on in EQ


apples to oranges

[Harrison]

Wow, 100% owned.

[Arlos]

Uh, Tikker, I'm in agreement with Duck on this. Would you call ME someone from a gimp guild who never did anything in EQ? Not to mention, you didn't join LOS til when, mid-Velious? So exactly how much high end raiding did you do in EQ initial release or in Kunark? Were you there when we did 13 unsuccessful Trakanon attempts, because our server sucked and OS crashed every time we fought him? (Yeah, EQ had its own server issues, don't forget) You can't compare initial release WOW to EQ after 3-4 expansions, that's ludicrous.

I say WOW is much better than EQ, in an awful lot of ways. Yes, EQ had some forced community aspects in the early days, but those are more than counterbalanced by the negatives, such as 2+ hour wait lists for spawn camps, and entire server populations flooding into 2 dungeons, where you'd spend most of your time sitting on your ass waiting for spawns. But, by Kunark, when you had the soloing waves progressing through LOIO and Dreadlands, never setting foot in a dungeon until the mid-50s (hello, Karnor's trains), you didn't have the same type of community either. Indeed, in many ways, at that point it is very analogous to WOW's community now: lots of people with little dungeon experience, who leveled up solo or in small groups outdoors, who hit the higher levels and suddenly have to learn how to dungeon crawl.

The ONLY reason Lyion's arguments about the smooth progression and such hold any water is if you strictly apply them to Nameless. The problem is, Nameless was one of the very last servers they put in, until the 2nd round of expansion much much later. Think about how it was for people on Mithaniel Marr or Veeshan, who's servers opened what, 6+ months before Nameless? They had months and months of nothing whatsoever to do but sit in increasingly crowded dungeons, raid Fear/Hate for the 937th time, or kill Naggy/Vox for the 600th. The progression path of expansion was nowhere near smooth for them.

I've really enjoyed the stuff I've done in Molten Core, and really enjoyed the attempts I made on Onyxia back in beta. I'm looking forward to playing around with her soon in release. No, as yet nothing has come close to the rush that our runs at the AOW did, but you know what? I'm not playing at that level at the moment, Evil Empire is nowhere near as hardcore and dedicated to raiding as LOS was. Maybe if I was in a guild like Afterlife or something, I'd have found that, I can't know til I get there. Not to mention, AOW was in the 2nd expansion, not initial release, nothing I did raiding in initial release EQ came close to the AOW either.

I also disagree on there being no death penalty, at least when it comes to instances. Losing XP like in EQ didn't make things challenging to me, it just made them annoying. Not to mention, how much of a penalty was it to a max level person who's grinding AA's anyway? Turn from 100% AA to 90% until you re-max, then switch back. Ooooh, ahhhh, what a disincentive. Even before AAs, regaining that XP at max level was trivial. In instances in WOW, however, if you wipe at the wrong point, and there's respawn up, you may have just wasted 2 hours, as there's no way to get back to where you were. This is especially the case in, say, Molten Core, where if you get to the Lucifron safe spot, say, then wipe without any rezzers able to come back in and rez in place, you're screwed.

-Arlos

[Tikker]

I think the difference is in how you look at it tho Arlos


I don't think anyone ever ENJOYED the death penalty in EQ, just like no one really liked PK's in UO, but they served a purpose, and when they were removed, worse problems arose



Overall as a game, WoW has the potential to be a much better game than EQ
The problems that have come up tho (Aside from the technical issues) have really turned off a big portion of the community

If you consider that WoW has had 5 years to study EQ, you'd think that their product would be leaps and bounds better


It's not


WoW is a marginal improvement upon EQ, with nothing really new, or exciting about it

You'd almost suspect that they were just sitting around looking at the original EQ< and just redesigning the same game


I really enjoyed every zone of WoW, but only the 1st time thru them
after that it was just all about collecting lewts

in EQ, it always took multiple trips to see every corner of a dungeon
You replace your gear so fast, you never become attached to items, or feel like you've accomplished something when you do finally replace it


I guess I was just expecting more out of WoW than EQ with new graphics

[Tikker]

I spent over a year playing UO prior to EQ, so playing MMORPG games wasn't new to me, but moving from UO to EQ was jumping ahead light years in game play

there were things i liked better about UO (tradeskills, housing, the cities, mass PvP), but overall EQ was a much more polished PvE game

I was expecting a change from EQ -> WOW like what happened in UO -> EQ


and that's probably why I'm dissappointed

[Tae-Bo]

Its fast food and packaged for the ADD crowd.

If you think sitting in a corner killing the same 8 MOBs over and over and over is a challenge, then I pity you. If you think that because someone could sit there and grind those 8 MOBs for hours means they have a better attention span, then I pity you. If you think that because it took months to grind enough iterations of those 8 MOBs to get to level 50 (or 60, 65, 70 whatever) that the game was better for it, then I pity you.

You just don't get it. A game is supposed to be fun... not work. EQ was work - it was hours upon hours of grinding for a level. It was hours and hours of camping for a spawn... only for it to not drop what you needed. It was hours upon endlessly stupid hours of killing green-con spiders (or rats, or whatever) for the 1500 silks you needed to skill up your tradeskills. It was hours upon hours of killing literally thousands of green-con mobs for faction to do a quest. YOU CALL THAT "BETTER"?

I pity you.

quoting this because it's true

Only reason people look back so fondly on EQ was because it was their first large-scale successful mmorpg, so they're using it as some sort of benchmark to compare WoW to.

WoW is a far, far superior game to EQ. However if you're the type of person who's into D&D roleplaying shit then I can imagine you'd like EQ better.

My guild has done most of the higher-end content, we've cleared MC up to Majordomo, killed Onyxia, killed Azuregos, killed Kazzak, and doing all of those were way more fun than doing anything I've done in EQ. And I look forward to doing them some more.

If you're having problems forming any type of community then grow a personality and become friends with people, I've met a shitload of cool people in the game.

Everything in WoW is superior to EQ, other than patching and server issues heh.

You like WoW better because you were just a gimp EQ player who didn't get to do a lot of the raiding, and now that you get to see the top end you're comparing top end WoW raiding, to being a gimp hanger on in EQ


apples to oranges

pfft

how is my situation back then any different from the situation you are in now?

[Tikker]

I raided high end WoW and EQ

you raided high end WoW


Seems simple


Right now I'm not raiding with my hunter, so I suppose if you wanted to nit pick, right this moment in time, you're raiding, and I am not


But I'd still like to point out (again) that I've always maintained that the Raiding encounters in WOW were just fine

It's the rest of the world that just seems like filler

In EQ, when I was raiding hardcore (let's pick a random encounter, SSra) in Luclin, it was still fun to go XP in FG for a bit, or go goof around in Acrylia, or whatever

During Luclin, when Sleepers/NTov were the shit, it was fun to hit up Velks, or ToFS, or even some of the expansion old content.


WoW just doesn't seem to be like that for me, and lots of others that I know


Instances are a blast the 1st couple of times, but after that they just start to get....i dunno, lonely

As much as people used to curse about the stupidity in /ooc, there were lots of times when it was really entertaining

[Malluas]

best ooc was in ToV when it was Shock (armor farming giants type) paragons (farming dragon armor) and LoS (owning NToV) that OOC was so fuckin hilarious.

[Tikker]

I always liked some of the LoS vs Sanctuary conversations


GRATS BERTON was always fun, and cargalia to SG will always bring a tear to my eye

[Lyion]

Nothing beats the Glubgawd Trak Party in the Reet Room.

[labbats]

Hey remember that one tim....

[Captain Insano]

Nothing beats the Glubgawd Trak Party in the Reet Room.

laffo... that spawned some of the best threads ever here.

[Arlos]

I dunno, the Ixnay implosion during the Cargalia train to Klandicar, and the follow up Dain despawn were pretty damn choice.

So was ES BP For Sale.

-Arlos

[liquidstayce]

i liked the one with ixnays cyber love.

[Tikker]

FUCK MEN AND IXNAY TOO

[Martrae]

i liked the one with ixnays cyber love.

Yeah, that was one of the best

[Captain Insano]

this thread needs more fuffalo