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by **Mop** » Mon Apr 25, 2005 1:24 pm

I used to think there was a gay ghost in my ex girlfriends house, but it turns out she was a guy and was violating me while I slept.

by **kaharthemad** » Mon Apr 25, 2005 1:26 pm

my proof is eye witness and my own accounts and not being able to disprove them scientifically toss. If you would like to try a ghost hunt I can give you a few places to start your search maybe even a few places around your area. I am not familar with Cali(?) but I believe there are a few places around the state.

by **Tossica** » Mon Apr 25, 2005 1:43 pm

You do realize that you or I being freaked out by some location does not prove the existence of ghosts, right? You do realize that knowing the history of a location or associating the physical, visual, olfactory, auditory characteristics of a location with some other place in your past will influence your expectations for that location right? You do realize that those expectations can and will influence the results of your experiences in that location right? My point is, your senses and experiences are yours alone and cannot be used as scientific data unless they can be studied in a controlled environment. You can believe what you like but do not try to act like some sort of scientist based on your personal experiences alone.

by **vonkaar** » Mon Apr 25, 2005 1:43 pm

Dude...

I'm not saying that it IS science. You are saying that it IS ghosts.

You see the diference now?

I'm *not* giving up. That's what scientists refuse to do. They keep on until they *can* find a reasonable explanation. YOU are saying, "oh well, I saw some freaky shit... I have no idea what it is so it must be ghosts." Galileo was put under house arrest for DARING to say that the heavens were ever-changing and that the best way to understand nature was through Mathematics, NOT religious studies. How backwards does that seem in relation to modern times?

By saying that science "may" prove otherwise, I'm leaving the door open to further exploration. By saying that these occurances *were* caused by GHOSTS most certainly is closing the door and taking a huge evolutionary step BACK in time. It's the same fucking thought-process as the Aztecs and Sumerians. I'm not the one burying my head in the sand here... you are the one narrowly focusing on the easiest answer in the history of mankind - "it must be God." Fuck that. Figure it out. If science proves the existence of ghosts and other supernatural entities, than guess what - science STILL wins. Having NO fucking ground to stand on other than, "science can't prove it, it MUST be the boogie-man" is fucking weak. If it turns out that it *is* ghosts and this IS proven, you merely got lucky with your uninformed, imbecilic guess.

by **Captain Insano** » Mon Apr 25, 2005 1:44 pm

Do they really have those ghost-detectometers like in ghostbusters that Egon used? If so that would be a great way to solve this arguement because ghost-decectometers are never wrong.

by **Tossica** » Mon Apr 25, 2005 1:45 pm

BTW, I live in Minnesota, suburban Minneapolis to be exact.

by **The Kizzy** » Mon Apr 25, 2005 1:46 pm

kaharthemad wrote:
Tossica wrote:You are seeing/hearing things that are not there.

Explained.

so are hundreds of other people.
Care to spend the night in Mansfield Prison? Im sure I can make it happnen.

im so there.

by **vonkaar** » Mon Apr 25, 2005 1:51 pm

ralfmacchio wrote:Do they really have those ghost-detectometers like in ghostbusters that Egon used? If so that would be a great way to solve this arguement because ghost-decectometers are never wrong.

Case in point - early Geiger counters were used by the 'paranormal' investigators to 'prove' the existence of ghostly apparitions. Radiation research was still in it's infancy and Hans Geiger's studies on alpha scattering mattered little to the ghost-chasers. Look! My meter is off the charts! This house is HAUNTED!!!!! Ignore the ceramic plates that are the source of this stray radiation, it's a GHOST!!

by **kaharthemad** » Mon Apr 25, 2005 2:39 pm

I am saying that this is the explanation after scienece fails. see my point? Anything that cannot be explained to your liking should just be ignored? The fact is enough people all over this country have seen things that can only be explained(at this point in time) as a paranormal event enough that it cannot be attributed to a bad bean supper. To not even suggest that it is part of the paranormal already drops logic out.

There are things that have not been explained to this day, i.e. Grey Friars Bobby. A dog is seen sleeping next to the grave of his master. When you get upclose to the grave the dog disappears. The Alamo people staying in motels and hotels nearby the site have seen disfigured me walking about.

I used to actually spend time in these places with motion sensors, cameras, and temperature meters, barametric pressure sensors. Most was gear I could piece together on a limited budget but I did what I can to jot down what information I could, I also brought a second witness with me to back up any documentation. Most of the stuff I bought could be purchased and rigged to work witha litmited budget. The motion detectors my firend used for instance was just a larm system (radio shack 59.95). This is also about 10 years since I have done any serious hunting. However like I said I would be willing to go exploring one of these places with you.

Not sure why I thought California for you Tossica. Forgive me on that point..If you want some places to check out Il can give you a few somewhat close to you. One that comes to mind is St. Mary's College this place i have visited and researched as well. Another one is the whole area surrounding Winona, MN seems there have been alot of sighting around that area. Quite a few from Edina, MN area as well.

As for the equipment they use, they used pressure sensors to detect changes in atmospheric density, they also use Infra Red Cameras and heat detectors. They have also use Giegers in the past but not as much anymore. Motion detectors like the one I describe above are used still but with meters going to a computer to track the amount of movement per variation. I.e. if Felix the cat walks across the room it will measure a variation of a certain variable. However if a plate is tossed across the room then the plate will have a different vairable since the size is different.

Kizzy your welcome to a sleep over with me but I think My wife might raise a eyebrow. However we get her to come along...hell two's company three is a adult movie.

by **veeneedefeesh** » Mon Apr 25, 2005 2:44 pm

Kahar is this a hobby with you or are you a professional paranormalist? Is this why you have the title of "the Mad"?

by **Zanchief** » Mon Apr 25, 2005 2:45 pm

I saw a ghost once...it was in the movie the sixth sense...

by **vonkaar** » Mon Apr 25, 2005 2:48 pm

kaharthemad wrote:I am saying that this is the explanation after scienece fails. see my point? Anything that cannot be explained to your liking should just be ignored?

Nope, but you don't "give up" and reference something which cannot be proven.

Otherwise... you should take no offense in my lumping you in with the Neanderthals. When the science of their time 'failed' (read: was insufficient), they attributed things to JuJu. You are doing the exact same thing, but seem to take serious offense in the similarities.

If I said that *I*, Mike Galloway, am responsible for every single paranormal activity that you've ever seen... it should be just as plausible as your dumbfounded belief that Ghosts caused them. You can't prove either, so... why not Leprechauns or homosexual flower people from Mars?

by **kaharthemad** » Mon Apr 25, 2005 2:53 pm

was a hobby of mine for a long time. I got into it because of a church my grandfather ministered to. There we times when he would come in the morning to find the linen on the alter folded and laying on the pulpit. Also came into find the candles lit. It was only on Sundays that this would happen and not every Sunday.

Also the study of the paranormal intrigued me form things that I saw over the years. problem was it was not things that could be explained away.

by **brinstar** » Mon Apr 25, 2005 4:14 pm

vonkaar wrote:So... if it can't be explained, it's Ghosts.

That's your stance?

what if he says he has Faith that ghosts exist

by **Yamori** » Mon Apr 25, 2005 4:44 pm

I believe in Oonies

"whats an oonie?"

I don't know

"then why do you belive in them?"

BECAUSE I HAVE FAITH!!!!1 :p

by **Rust** » Mon Apr 25, 2005 4:52 pm

Tossica wrote:BTW, I live in Minnesota, suburban Minneapolis to be exact.

I'm headed to Plymouth MN tomorrow for a day.

><

--R.

by **Harrison** » Mon Apr 25, 2005 4:53 pm

Holy fuck it's entertaining to watch self proclaimed "intelligent" people completely shut their brains off and spout off a bunch of ignorant bullshit.

by **Tossica** » Mon Apr 25, 2005 4:57 pm

Here is the deal for me.

Science may not be able to explain everything yet, this is a given BUT to put the blame for unexplained phenom on ghosts requires more leaps of faith than I am willing to take. First of all, I would have to take the leap of faith that is believing in a "soul". That is a MAJOR leap of faith for me. Once I have accepted the fact that a soul may exist, I then have to accept that this shapeless, theoretical soul is something that is able to manifest itself physically sans a vessel for it to occupy. What this says to me is that there is something physical (meaning it can interact with the physical world) inside me that is completely seperate from my body. This isn't a soul like in a burst of energy or something, this is my personality, characteristics, memories, etc existing without my brain, body etc. This is just too outrageous for me to accept. You have to realize how difficult it would be for someone like me to accept ghosts as an explanation, right? That being said, once you have already accepted that a "soul" is not only plausible but that it actually exists as described, then I can see how it would be easy to accept that things you can't immediately explain must be ghosts. To me it seems very childlike and ignorant but I can see where the conclusion comes from.

by **Tossica** » Mon Apr 25, 2005 4:58 pm

Rust wrote:
Tossica wrote:BTW, I live in Minnesota, suburban Minneapolis to be exact.

I'm headed to Plymouth MN tomorrow for a day.

><

--R.

My lawyer lives in Plymouth. Don't tell him where I am, I owe him $200.

by **Captain Insano** » Mon Apr 25, 2005 5:10 pm

Harrison wrote:Holy fuck it's entertaining to watch self proclaimed "intelligent" people completely shut their brains off and spout off a bunch of ignorant bullshit.

Great insight there Sherbert Heimstein.

by **The Kizzy** » Mon Apr 25, 2005 9:12 pm

Harrison wrote:Holy fuck it's entertaining to watch self proclaimed "intelligent" people completely shut their brains off and spout off a bunch of ignorant bullshit.

I'm confused on who's side you are on. I thought you believed in ghosts.

by **Harrison** » Mon Apr 25, 2005 9:27 pm

Vonkaar/Tossica/Ostrich Crew

Hiding behind the guise of being "scientists" yet saying some of the most ignorant shit I've ever seen.

"u r neanderthals cuz siance sez no gosts dude lolz wut morons"

by **Diabolik** » Mon Apr 25, 2005 9:30 pm

perhaps we don't really exist *looks up at the sky*

by **Narrock** » Mon Apr 25, 2005 9:31 pm

Kizzy wrote:
Harrison wrote:Holy fuck it's entertaining to watch self proclaimed "intelligent" people completely shut their brains off and spout off a bunch of ignorant bullshit.

I'm confused on who's side you are on. I thought you believed in ghosts.

I think he does believe in ghosts, but he's also just pointing out the ridiculousness of certain people here on the NT who consistently laud themselves as persons with superior intellect who consistently post in such a manner as to completely invalidate and nullify that claim which in actuality exemplifies and substantiates their obvious true intelligence level which is much lower than they claim. It's especially funny when they high-five each other and support each other after they've claimed victory of "ownage" over another poster outside of their little support network clan. But we know better.

So, in this instance... Finawin Harrison is absolutely correct.

by **Harrison** » Mon Apr 25, 2005 9:45 pm

For as much as I hate to admit Mindia hit the nail on the head.

Sitting around with a flock of retards hooting and hollering "ya ya ya" doesn't make you any more correct than the guy sitting alone saying the world is flat.

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so wtf is up with this, you tell me

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