Happy 30th, A-Rod!
Moderators: Mop, Dictators in Training
Happy 30th, A-Rod!
He is quickly turning from a young guy to an older veteran. Still the best all around player in the league.
Tejada doesnt run enough. You need someone that is a 5 tool guy for best all around imho. That list is short.....
Bobby Abreau
Derrick Lee
Alex Rodriguez
Carlos Beltran (even though he has sucked this year)
Tori Hunter is widely considered one of the best (batting average needs to go up)
Alfonso Soriano
Ichiro Suzuki
Albert Pujols
and Derek Jeter.
Those sum up my list (i probably forgot 1 or 2 players)
Tejada and Vlad Guerro (unfortuanatly he doesnt run anymore), are close though.
Bobby Abreau
Derrick Lee
Alex Rodriguez
Carlos Beltran (even though he has sucked this year)
Tori Hunter is widely considered one of the best (batting average needs to go up)
Alfonso Soriano
Ichiro Suzuki
Albert Pujols
and Derek Jeter.
Those sum up my list (i probably forgot 1 or 2 players)
Tejada and Vlad Guerro (unfortuanatly he doesnt run anymore), are close though.
Why fight it, i am a Man Whore!
Xaiveir Tanthalas wrote:Tejada doesnt run enough. You need someone that is a 5 tool guy for best all around imho. That list is short.....
Bobby Abreau
Derrick Lee
Alex Rodriguez
Carlos Beltran (even though he has sucked this year)
Tori Hunter is widely considered one of the best (batting average needs to go up)
Alfonso Soriano
Ichiro Suzuki
Albert Pujols
and Derek Jeter.
Those sum up my list (i probably forgot 1 or 2 players)
Tejada and Vlad Guerro (unfortuanatly he doesnt run anymore), are close though.
I wouldnt put Suzuki, Hunter, or Jeter on that list both doesnt have the power numbers. Soriano and Abreu doesnt have the top notch defense. Just because Tejada doesnt run enough doesnt meant that he cant. He can steal bases but thats not his game. Tejada still is my choice for best all around player with Guerrero and Pujols close behind.
A-Rod has over 200 career stolen bases and had 28 I believe last year...Miguel doesn't run enough and is inconsistent defensively...Derek Lee is a good choice this year but he has never hit for a good average besides this year (how many times in his career has he hit over .280?)...
I agree with X's list besides Alfonso because he is quite possibly the worst fielding second basemen I've ever seen play, besides the old days of Chuck Knoblach.
I agree with X's list besides Alfonso because he is quite possibly the worst fielding second basemen I've ever seen play, besides the old days of Chuck Knoblach.
A rod does run very well. 10 SB's this year 28 last year, thats pretty good, especially for someone that hits number 3 in a stacked Yankees lineup.
Tejada has 5 this year, and 10 was his career high in 2003, and only 58 for his career. Again he is deffinatly up there as far as best all around. Suzuki is on there because he is a great all around athlete. He can hit for power, he just doesnt batting leadoff. During batting practice he hits more homeruns than anyone on the Mariners, and MLB tried to get him to do the homerun Derby this year.
This is the top 10 position players in Fantasy baseball. This could be interesting to discuss how that fits in with all around athlete.
D. Lee (ChC - 1B)
A. Pujols (StL - 1B)
Á. Rodríguez (NYY - 3B)
Mi. Cabrera (Fla - OF)
M. Teixeira (Tex - 1B)
D. Ortiz (Bos - 1B)
A. Soriano (Tex - 2B)
M. Ramírez (Bos - OF)
A. Jones (Atl - OF)
G. Sheffield (NYY - OF)
Tejada has 5 this year, and 10 was his career high in 2003, and only 58 for his career. Again he is deffinatly up there as far as best all around. Suzuki is on there because he is a great all around athlete. He can hit for power, he just doesnt batting leadoff. During batting practice he hits more homeruns than anyone on the Mariners, and MLB tried to get him to do the homerun Derby this year.
This is the top 10 position players in Fantasy baseball. This could be interesting to discuss how that fits in with all around athlete.
D. Lee (ChC - 1B)
A. Pujols (StL - 1B)
Á. Rodríguez (NYY - 3B)
Mi. Cabrera (Fla - OF)
M. Teixeira (Tex - 1B)
D. Ortiz (Bos - 1B)
A. Soriano (Tex - 2B)
M. Ramírez (Bos - OF)
A. Jones (Atl - OF)
G. Sheffield (NYY - OF)
Why fight it, i am a Man Whore!
Xaiveir Tanthalas wrote:A rod does run very well. 10 SB's this year 28 last year, thats pretty good, especially for someone that hits number 3 in a stacked Yankees lineup.
Tejada has 5 this year, and 10 was his career high in 2003, and only 58 for his career. Again he is deffinatly up there as far as best all around. Suzuki is on there because he is a great all around athlete. He can hit for power, he just doesnt batting leadoff. During batting practice he hits more homeruns than anyone on the Mariners, and MLB tried to get him to do the homerun Derby this year.
You can't possibly discount Tejada from the discussion based solely on his stolen base numbers, while including Suzuki and ignoring his slugging numbers. Either you look past the numbers, in which case Tejada's dismissal needs a deeper justification, or you accept the numbers at face value, in which case Ichiro is right out.
Ok, first Xao im going to defend Ichiro here. Ichiro has average power and slugging compared to the major league average. At 9 homeruns a an OPS of .801 he ranks at the major league average this year. He is a GREAT base runner, steals bags with ease, has a great average, a cannon for an arm, the best range of any OF in baseball, and has enough gold gloves to fill a display case. But that is just this year, career wise his numbers are better. He fits my list because for an all around "athlete" he is a great athlete in every catagory.
Tejada on the other hand, has never won a gold glove, his range is limited, his speed is average, he is not a great baserunner (average at best), and is not a threat to steal.
Tejada is station to station baseball player and should not be considered a top athlete. All he does is hit homeruns and drive in runs. Great thats his job, but he could never be anything but that. For instance, he could not be a good leadoff hitter. In my post that you quoted i did say he was up there though.
One difference is Tejada could not be a base stealer if he tried. Tejada will never win a gold glove at short. Ichiro if he wasnt doing his job as a leadoff hitter could increase his power numbers if he chose too. Ichiro could hit 3 on many different teams and hit 25 homeruns a year. (i think he should be a 3 hitter personally) Thats a key difference.
Soriano actually shouldnt be on the list, i was picking that quickly. He is in the same boat as tejada.
Again the list was my Opinion, not yours. I have many reasons why the people on that list are there.
Tejada on the other hand, has never won a gold glove, his range is limited, his speed is average, he is not a great baserunner (average at best), and is not a threat to steal.
Tejada is station to station baseball player and should not be considered a top athlete. All he does is hit homeruns and drive in runs. Great thats his job, but he could never be anything but that. For instance, he could not be a good leadoff hitter. In my post that you quoted i did say he was up there though.
One difference is Tejada could not be a base stealer if he tried. Tejada will never win a gold glove at short. Ichiro if he wasnt doing his job as a leadoff hitter could increase his power numbers if he chose too. Ichiro could hit 3 on many different teams and hit 25 homeruns a year. (i think he should be a 3 hitter personally) Thats a key difference.
Soriano actually shouldnt be on the list, i was picking that quickly. He is in the same boat as tejada.
Again the list was my Opinion, not yours. I have many reasons why the people on that list are there.
Why fight it, i am a Man Whore!
Tejada is very athletic. He has range and a very strong arm. He also has speed. Just because he doesnt steal bases doesnt mean that he is slow. Here is what Stats Inc. said about him:
Hitting
Tejada generates his home-run power to left and left-center field. His doubles power ranges from foul line to foul line. Tejada's swing is more compact that it used to be, yet he struggles with soft-tossers. Finesse pitchers are able to keep him off stride and reduce his power. His slight uppercut swing allows groundball pitchers to keep the ball in the park and have success against him. Tejada remains one of the better hitters in the American League with runners in scoring position. He's more productive batting fourth than in the No. 3 spot.
Baserunning & Defense
While Tejada generated 24 errors in 2004, he still is considered one of the American League's top shortstops. His range is among the best in the league, especially going into the hole. Tejada has a plus arm and can make all the required throws. He's adept at turning the double play, recording a league-leading 118 at short last season. While he rarely steals a base, he can go from first to third on singles to right field. His speed allows him to score from second on most hits to the outfield.
Hitting
Tejada generates his home-run power to left and left-center field. His doubles power ranges from foul line to foul line. Tejada's swing is more compact that it used to be, yet he struggles with soft-tossers. Finesse pitchers are able to keep him off stride and reduce his power. His slight uppercut swing allows groundball pitchers to keep the ball in the park and have success against him. Tejada remains one of the better hitters in the American League with runners in scoring position. He's more productive batting fourth than in the No. 3 spot.
Baserunning & Defense
While Tejada generated 24 errors in 2004, he still is considered one of the American League's top shortstops. His range is among the best in the league, especially going into the hole. Tejada has a plus arm and can make all the required throws. He's adept at turning the double play, recording a league-leading 118 at short last season. While he rarely steals a base, he can go from first to third on singles to right field. His speed allows him to score from second on most hits to the outfield.
Xaiveir Tanthalas wrote:Ok, first Xao im going to defend Ichiro here. Ichiro has average power and slugging compared to the major league average. At 9 homeruns a an OPS of .801 he ranks at the major league average this year. He is a GREAT base runner, steals bags with ease, has a great average, a cannon for an arm, the best range of any OF in baseball, and has enough gold gloves to fill a display case. But that is just this year, career wise his numbers are better. He fits my list because for an all around "athlete" he is a great athlete in every catagory.
Tejada on the other hand, has never won a gold glove, his range is limited, his speed is average, he is not a great baserunner (average at best), and is not a threat to steal.
So now you're defending Ichiro on the basis of 'average' power, but deriding Tejada's 'average' speed? I'm definitely in Ichiro's corner, as he's been one of an absurdly few bright spots on the M's lately, but your rationale for dismissing Tejada needs to be reconsidered.
Tejada is station to station baseball player and should not be considered a top athlete. All he does is hit homeruns and drive in runs. Great thats his job, but he could never be anything but that. For instance, he could not be a good leadoff hitter. In my post that you quoted i did say he was up there though.
It's difficult to say that he couldn't fill positions he hasn't been asked to take.
One difference is Tejada could not be a base stealer if he tried. Tejada will never win a gold glove at short. Ichiro if he wasnt doing his job as a leadoff hitter could increase his power numbers if he chose too. Ichiro could hit 3 on many different teams and hit 25 homeruns a year. (i think he should be a 3 hitter personally) Thats a key difference.
Tejada has some pretty stiff competition at short, but he's certaintly a competent defensive player.