Complete and utter bullshit
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Complete and utter bullshit
How the fuck can you give A-rod the MVP over Ortiz? HOW? Like the Yankees would have collapsed without him...give me a fucking break.
Lyion wrote:If Hillary wins Texas and Ohio, she'll win the nomination.
Tossica wrote:Seriously, there is NO WAY Sony is going to put HD-DVD out of the game.
My idea of an MVP is someone who, if removed from the team, completely removes any chance of said team ever achieving the same level of success that they had with him.
Now that may not be right but that's my idea of an MVP.
It seems like every other night Ortiz was singlehandedly winning games for Boston with the swing of a bat a la Barry Bonds.
A-Rod is a good player, but not a true MVP in the sense of the word in this case because the Yankees could have done without and still had a comparable level of success.
Now that may not be right but that's my idea of an MVP.
It seems like every other night Ortiz was singlehandedly winning games for Boston with the swing of a bat a la Barry Bonds.
A-Rod is a good player, but not a true MVP in the sense of the word in this case because the Yankees could have done without and still had a comparable level of success.
Lyion wrote:If Hillary wins Texas and Ohio, she'll win the nomination.
Tossica wrote:Seriously, there is NO WAY Sony is going to put HD-DVD out of the game.
You must not have read my post.
The award in my opinion isn't like a batting title or a "who did what better", it is more of a "who could a particular team honestly not live without and still experience similar success."
The award in my opinion isn't like a batting title or a "who did what better", it is more of a "who could a particular team honestly not live without and still experience similar success."
Lyion wrote:If Hillary wins Texas and Ohio, she'll win the nomination.
Tossica wrote:Seriously, there is NO WAY Sony is going to put HD-DVD out of the game.
No, I read your post, and I'm disagreeing with you
if you're going to claim Ortiz was important to his team, what criteria would you offer?
His batting statistics
A-Rod offered superior batting statistics to his team as well as great defensive abilities
if you replace A-rod with a shitty hitter, but equally good defensive skills, you lose exactly as much as if you replace ortiz with a shitty DH
but if you replace A-Rod with a shitty hitter/shitty fielder you lose much more than losing Ortiz's bat
therefore, A-rod is more valuable than Ortiz
if you're going to claim Ortiz was important to his team, what criteria would you offer?
His batting statistics
A-Rod offered superior batting statistics to his team as well as great defensive abilities
if you replace A-rod with a shitty hitter, but equally good defensive skills, you lose exactly as much as if you replace ortiz with a shitty DH
but if you replace A-Rod with a shitty hitter/shitty fielder you lose much more than losing Ortiz's bat
therefore, A-rod is more valuable than Ortiz
Actually, comparing stats it's easy to get misled.
While A-Rod has a better overall batting line (0.29 higher OPS), check out what happens in the clutch, when games are won or lost. (Something an MVP should have a say about, winning games for your team.)
Clutch Hitting is defined as the 7th inning or later, being either ahead by 1 run, losing by 1 or 2, or tied.
A-Rod: 74 AB's, .297 AVG, .422 OBP, .527 SLG, 4 HR, 12 RBI
Looks pretty decent yes? A-Rod probably won a few games on his own in the clutch with those kind of numbers.
Let's look at Ortiz: 76 AB's, .329 AVG, .435 OBP, .803 SLG, 10 HR, 31 RBI
Ortiz absolutely blows A-Rod out of the water. He's single-handedly won far more games for the Red Sox. Games that would have resulted in losses. This is what some argue as the true definition of MVP: the difference in runs/wins between the MVP candidate and his potential replacement.
As far as the DH goes, pitchers have won MVP awards. And they play every 5 days. The insinuation that a certain position isn't eligible for MVP doesn't belong in the discourse. Get rid of the position if it's not a real position; but as long as it is the rule, it's a position. Ortiz could have just as easily played 1B all year, but he doesn't have to.
While A-Rod has a better overall batting line (0.29 higher OPS), check out what happens in the clutch, when games are won or lost. (Something an MVP should have a say about, winning games for your team.)
Clutch Hitting is defined as the 7th inning or later, being either ahead by 1 run, losing by 1 or 2, or tied.
A-Rod: 74 AB's, .297 AVG, .422 OBP, .527 SLG, 4 HR, 12 RBI
Looks pretty decent yes? A-Rod probably won a few games on his own in the clutch with those kind of numbers.
Let's look at Ortiz: 76 AB's, .329 AVG, .435 OBP, .803 SLG, 10 HR, 31 RBI
Ortiz absolutely blows A-Rod out of the water. He's single-handedly won far more games for the Red Sox. Games that would have resulted in losses. This is what some argue as the true definition of MVP: the difference in runs/wins between the MVP candidate and his potential replacement.
As far as the DH goes, pitchers have won MVP awards. And they play every 5 days. The insinuation that a certain position isn't eligible for MVP doesn't belong in the discourse. Get rid of the position if it's not a real position; but as long as it is the rule, it's a position. Ortiz could have just as easily played 1B all year, but he doesn't have to.
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Zanchief
numatu wrote:Actually, comparing stats it's easy to get misled.
While A-Rod has a better overall batting line (0.29 higher OPS), check out what happens in the clutch, when games are won or lost. (Something an MVP should have a say about, winning games for your team.)
Clutch Hitting is defined as the 7th inning or later, being either ahead by 1 run, losing by 1 or 2, or tied.
A-Rod: 74 AB's, .297 AVG, .422 OBP, .527 SLG, 4 HR, 12 RBI
Looks pretty decent yes? A-Rod probably won a few games on his own in the clutch with those kind of numbers.
Let's look at Ortiz: 76 AB's, .329 AVG, .435 OBP, .803 SLG, 10 HR, 31 RBI
Ortiz absolutely blows A-Rod out of the water.
Ok, now compare Ortiz's defensive stats compared to A-Rods
how many games has A-Rod won because he's made a clutch play at 3rd base
now compare that to Ortiz
oh wait, Ortiz doesn't contribute defensively at all
what was that you were saying again about ortiz being more valuable?
Tikker wrote:oh wait, Ortiz doesn't contribute defensively at all
And Barry Bonds did? Jason Giambi? Mo Vaughn?
Forget it. You want to turn this into a flame type shindig with your idiotic fanboi comment and I'm not taking the bait. I don't particularly care for Boston (re: 2004 World Series) but I know baseball.
You know my opinion, that's the end of it for me.
Lyion wrote:If Hillary wins Texas and Ohio, she'll win the nomination.
Tossica wrote:Seriously, there is NO WAY Sony is going to put HD-DVD out of the game.
You're the one trying to make a gold glove the non issue
You're whining that Ortiz deserved it more than A-rod
The fact of the matter is that A-Rod excels offensively, and defensively, and Ortiz wasn't good enough to play in the field
I mean, sure he could have played 1st base, and you could have stuck mo vaughn at DH
but they didn't
likely because Vaughn is a better fielder than Ortiz
You're whining that Ortiz deserved it more than A-rod
The fact of the matter is that A-Rod excels offensively, and defensively, and Ortiz wasn't good enough to play in the field
I mean, sure he could have played 1st base, and you could have stuck mo vaughn at DH
but they didn't
likely because Vaughn is a better fielder than Ortiz
Haffner i think got 2 votes i believe, had he played the full season he would have been my pick.
In the end, Arod was the correct pick. Not taking anything away from Ortiz, but Arod had the better year, and would have been the MVP of any team. He brought more to the table than ortiz did.
In the end, Arod was the correct pick. Not taking anything away from Ortiz, but Arod had the better year, and would have been the MVP of any team. He brought more to the table than ortiz did.
Why fight it, i am a Man Whore!
Name a Manny type player A-Rod had in Seattle and Texas that batted behind him. (When I mean Manny type player, I mean one of the best overall hitters ever to play the game. Manny is that good and that scary.)
A-Rod has always played the game at a consistent level. That's the reason why he has won 2 different MVP's, with 2 different teams, in 2 different positions.
Ortiz came to Boston as a bench player, he never had stats like he has now until he was batting in front of Manny. He wasn't supposed to be the DH. Ortiz caught lightning in bottle when he came to Boston.
Fact is, you could put A-Rod in Tampa Bay and he'll still put up numbers that will rival similar MVP type years he's already had, and he'll still field as well as he has been in 2 different positions. Can Ortiz do the same as DH in Tampa? I seriously doubt it. He'll have to prove he can still play at a high level when Manny isn't on the team.
A-Rod has always played the game at a consistent level. That's the reason why he has won 2 different MVP's, with 2 different teams, in 2 different positions.
Ortiz came to Boston as a bench player, he never had stats like he has now until he was batting in front of Manny. He wasn't supposed to be the DH. Ortiz caught lightning in bottle when he came to Boston.
Fact is, you could put A-Rod in Tampa Bay and he'll still put up numbers that will rival similar MVP type years he's already had, and he'll still field as well as he has been in 2 different positions. Can Ortiz do the same as DH in Tampa? I seriously doubt it. He'll have to prove he can still play at a high level when Manny isn't on the team.
Adivina wrote:We are the most bipolar acting community, bunch of manics with the mood swings on here.