homosexuality has a physical basis not learned behavior

[Lyion]

But.... evolution is about survival of the fittest, and not about self healing whatsoever so your point isn't really valid when used in that analogy.

Also, if you want to use the evolution analogy and be comparative to other species, why don't other animals have chemical imbalances?

Diabetes is often derived from diet, lack of exercise, and other health issues. Thus, like what some were referring in regards to depression, it is self inflicted, and can be self cured.

[Zanchief]

But.... evolution is about survival of the fittest, and not about self healing whatsoever so your point isn't really valid when used in that analogy.

Not exactly.

Evolution is about the likelihood of a species matting. Survival of the fittest doesn't have much to do with evolution nowadays since the vast majority of people make to an age where they can reproduce.

Doesn't help gay people since they could live to be 100 and still not reproduce, but I just thought I should clarify.

[Gidan]

The evolution analogy is very flawed basically because your view of evolution is off. This however is not a thread on evolution and if goes that way it will just be another evolution -> religion thread that goes no where.

[Lyion]

Only when the Canadian atheists roll out the Jesus card, since the three Christians out of one hundred people on this board never do. Note, Mindia is not a Christian. He's more like a Draenei Exile.

Anyways, I'll retract 'Survival of the Fittest' and input Natural Selection, which is the same thing.

That ignores the simple question if chemical imbalances are biological and natural, why don't we see them in other species?

[Zanchief]

Only when the Canadian atheists roll out the Jesus card, since the three Christians out of one hundred people on this board never do.

How trollish, hypocrite.

[Lyion]

I must see if this works

[Thon]

That ignores the simple question if chemical imbalances are biological and natural, why don't we see them in other species?

how do you know there arn't chemical imbalances in non-humans? just because dogs don't run around screaming that the CIA is brainwashing them doesn't mean it isn't there. i've had lots of dogs in my life, and i swear a few of them were batshit insane

there's plenty of evidence of species becoming depressed. especially ones in captivity, like elephants. if it can happen due to that environment i'm sure it can happen "naturally" out in the wild

Anyways, I'll retract 'Survival of the Fittest' and input Natural Selection, which is the same thing.

no, they're not the same.

[Tikker]

Only when the Canadian atheists roll out the Jesus card, since the three Christians out of one hundred people on this board never do. Note, Mindia is not a Christian. He's more like a Draenei Exile.

Anyways, I'll retract 'Survival of the Fittest' and input Natural Selection, which is the same thing.

That ignores the simple question if chemical imbalances are biological and natural, why don't we see them in other species?

you see roughly the same percentage of homosexuality amongst a species in EVERY mammalian group on the planet

[Tikker]

I'd google it up for you, but I know how you hate it when people prove their points. You're much more into wild conjecture and falling back on the "goddidit" or "goddidn'tdoit" so have at it.

[Tossica]

Depression is a natural coping mechanism that most likely occurs in many creatures. Letting depression consume you is an unconscious choice a person makes. While you are depressed, it's near impossible to see the way out but once you find it, it all becomes clear. You are in complete control over how you cope with disappointments in life and there are many, many things you can do to "help" yourself out of the rut and medication can be a very helpful tool in this process. Coming to the conclusion that you have a chemical imbalance that is beyond your control is bullshit and a cop out. I personally have proven it to many people over the years.

If you think your life sucks and there is nothing worth getting out of bed for then do something about it.

[ClakarEQ]

Lyion, diabities can be caused from the exact opposite of your example

I'm living proof, never been overwieght, have been active in sports most of my life, etc. I'm not saying I'm not an anomoly or that I wasn't subjected to an external cause throughout my life, but I've spoken to Dr's directly on this point and they don't know.

They DO know that folks that fit your example have an increased risk and they "assume" it is because of the reason you posted. All sorts of data are available to this point but the cause in fact is unknown.

[Lyion]

Chemical imbalances really weren't inline with the homosexuality discussion, but were more inline with the depression thread here.

Why actually debate things when you can take potshots, though. It's the NT way.

http://www.bartleby.com/11/4003.html

Charles Robert Darwin (1809–1882). Origin of Species.
The Harvard Classics. 1909–14.

IV. Natural Selection; or the Survival of the Fittest

Illustrations of the Action of Natural Selection, or the Survival of the Fittest

[ClakarEQ]

O and to the point of other mammals or species. You've never seen a male dog try to hump another male?

I've got 2 dogs, 2 guinee pigs, 2 fish, 1 white dove as pets (my wife is a HUGE animal lover). Anyway, the guinee pigs are male and female, the female trys to HUMP the male, not the other way around (and they are kept in two cages, I don't want babies).

The dove though, and if you know anything about birds it is almost impossible to "sex" a bird where the male / female don't have external color differences (e.g. white doves), The dove has actually humped both of my dogs, it is a funny sight, so there isn't just an issue of gay amongts other species, I'd go so far to say that sexual drive and these chemical issues are in fact problems in other species but they aren't seen as much because in the wild the weakest die.

[Harrison]

Dogs do it to exert dominance as well...(as do most other mammals)

[Tossica]

is that why you do it Harrison or do you just like man ass?

[Spliffs]

Depression is a natural coping mechanism that most likely occurs in many creatures. Letting depression consume you is an unconscious choice a person makes. While you are depressed, it's near impossible to see the way out but once you find it, it all becomes clear. You are in complete control over how you cope with disappointments in life and there are many, many things you can do to "help" yourself out of the rut and medication can be a very helpful tool in this process. Coming to the conclusion that you have a chemical imbalance that is beyond your control is bullshit and a cop out. I personally have proven it to many people over the years.

If you think your life sucks and there is nothing worth getting out of bed for then do something about it.

That's retarded. Did you even read that last sentence? How are you going to do something about it, if there is nothing worth getting out of bed for? It can't go both ways.

You do realize we are talking about clinical depression here right? Not someone who thinks their "life sucks." Most depressed people can't put a finger on why they are depressed, that is what is so scary about it. If there was a reason you could do something about it.

There is a big difference between having a bad day, or week, or month, and being depressed. Real depression needs no justification.

Furthermore, just because *you* believe a person can fix themselves, doesn't mean they believe it. When it comes to thoughts and emotions, a person creates their own reality. Some people *can't* fix themselves, because their mind doesn't work like yours does.

[Tossica]

Furthermore, just because *you* believe a person can fix themselves, doesn't mean they believe it. When it comes to thoughts and emotions, a person creates their own reality. Some people *can't* fix themselves, because their mind doesn't work like yours does.

They can and won't. I firmly believe it's something that a person can fix themselves if they choose to do so. Change your environment, job, relationships, hobbies, routine, find god, etc or just sit and rot in your own self pity. The choice is yours.

[Harrison]

Depression is a natural coping mechanism that most likely occurs in many creatures. Letting depression consume you is an unconscious choice a person makes. While you are depressed, it's near impossible to see the way out but once you find it, it all becomes clear. You are in complete control over how you cope with disappointments in life and there are many, many things you can do to "help" yourself out of the rut and medication can be a very helpful tool in this process. Coming to the conclusion that you have a chemical imbalance that is beyond your control is bullshit and a cop out. I personally have proven it to many people over the years.

If you think your life sucks and there is nothing worth getting out of bed for then do something about it.

Plain and simple...

You have no clue what you're talking about. There is absolutely no factual basis to what you said at all.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clinical_d ... depression

Read up, fucking educate yourself.

Clinical depression isn't just something that happened because you got dumped, lost your job, lost a family member in an accident, etc. It's always there, and you can't just "make it better". If you did, you weren't clinically depressed to begin with.

[Harrison]

Your firm belief (beliefs are based on faith, not fact OMG an atheist doesn't get this point! IRONY ALERT)is as valid as my firm belief that hamsters have wings and rain coconuts on my pitiful city.

[Tossica]

Huh, so the ONLY way to "cure" clinical depression is with medication? Bullshit.

Keep thinking that and pfizer and co will continue to laugh all the way to the bank.

You are both full of shit. People are cured every day and many of them do it without the use of medications. You have all the tools you need to treat it, you just need someone to show you how to use them and the motivation to "fix" your life.

[DangerPaul]

marijuana is the best option

[Lyion]

From Harrisons wiki link

Although the causal relationship is unclear, it is known that antidepressant medications can relieve certain symptoms of depression, although critics point out that the relationship between serotonin, SSRIs, and depression usually is typically greatly oversimplified

Treatment of depression varies broadly and is different for each individual. Various types and combinations of treatments may have to be tried. There are two primary modes of treatment, typically used in conjunction: medication and psychotherapy. A third treatment, electroconvulsive therapy (ECT), may be used when chemical treatment fails.

Other alternative treatments used for depression include exercise and the use of vitamins, herbs, or other nutritional supplements.

The effectiveness of treatment often depends on factors such as the amount of optimism and hope the sufferer is able to maintain, the control s/he has over stressors, the severity of symptoms, the amount of time the sufferer has been depressed, the results of previous treatments, and the degree of support of family, friends, and significant others.

Although treatment is generally effective, in some cases the condition does not respond. Treatment-resistant depression warrants a full assessment, which may lead to the addition of psychotherapy, higher medication dosages, changes of medication or combination therapy, a trial of ECT/electroshock, or even a change in the diagnosis, with subsequent treatment changes. Although this process helps many, some people's symptoms continue unabated.

There are many therapeutic approaches, but all are aimed at improving one's personal and interpersonal functioning. Cognitive therapy, also known as Cognitive Behavior Therapy, focuses on how people think about themselves and their relationships. It helps depressed people learn to replace negative depressive thoughts with positive ones, as well as develop more effective coping behaviors and skills. Therapy can be used to help a person develop or improve interpersonal skills in order to allow him or her to communicate more effectively and reduce stress.Interpersonal psychotherapy focuses on the social and interpesronal triggers that cause their depression.

Narrative therapy gives attention to each person's "dominant story" by means of therapeutic conversations, which also may involve exploring unhelpful ideas and how they came to prominence. Possible social and cultural influences may be explored if the client deems it helpful.

Behavioral therapy is based on the assumption that behaviors are learned. This type of therapy attempts to teach people more healthful types of behaviors. Supportive therapy encourages people to discuss their problems and provides them with emotional support. The focus is on sharing information, ideas, and strategies for coping with daily life. Family therapy helps people live together more harmoniously and undo patterns of destructive behavior.

It is widely believed that physical activity and exercise help depressed patients and promote quicker and better relief from depression.

[Thon]

Read up, fucking educate yourself.

there's the only irony alert

[Spliffs]

Medication isn't the only way for everyone. However, it definitely is for some people.

What if motivation is the tool you are lacking? Sure, that sucks, and may make you a weak person, but does that make you any less depressed?

[Harrison]

Huh, so the ONLY way to "cure" clinical depression is with medication? Bullshit.

Keep thinking that and pfizer and co will continue to laugh all the way to the bank.

You are both full of shit. People are cured every day and many of them do it without the use of medications. You have all the tools you need to treat it, you just need someone to show you how to use them and the motivation to "fix" your life.

If you just stand up and say, "viola! I'm cured!" you weren't clinically depressed. What part of this don't you understand?



This is like debating whether or not there is a God or not with Mindia.

If I were to hit my head, there is the possibility that I caused damage that would cause me to be clinically depressed.

I wouldn't know why I feel "down" constantly, I can't just "turn it off", and nothing I would do besides seek treatment would cure it.

Sure, I could feel fucking great for a day or two, then BAM out of the blue I wake up and can't figure out why I feel that waking up isn't even worth it. So I "sleep" for 18 hours a day for a few days...eat less, loss of REM sleep cycle, etc. It's not like sleeping made me think "life sucks" and I turned emo overnight.

Then out of the blue I would feel great, start continuing with my normal routine for awhile etc.

That was a hypothetical situation, I used head trauma as an example of a possible cause for it.