hey mindia

[Narrock]

no its just christians interpret scripture to suit them
it doesnt matter if you celebrate a pagan holiday to honor god you are still celebrating a pagan holiday

calling it christian because some catholic pope said it was ok in 1100 ad doesnt make it ok in the eyes of god

same thing for easter (doesnt even bother chaning the pagan name fesitval there) samhain or any other of the so called xtian holidays

the scripture i quoted specifically forbids the followers of god to learn the ways of the ways of the pagans .. xmas is a pagan holiday with holy water sprinkled on it cant change that simple fact

you can condem a homosexual for claiming to be christian because the bible forbids it but you can practice clearly pagan traditions just because "my parents did it and the pope said it was ok"
oh god loves you mindia

I celebrate the Birthday of Christ, and the Resurrection of Christ. I do not celebrate those days in lieu of a pagan holiday or festival. And I don't give a flying rat's ass what the pope has to say.

oh, and God loves you too

[dammuzis]

but as someone posted earlier it could not possibly be christs birthday and nowhere is it commanded to keep it. did you know that the puritans made christmas illegal because of its pagan orgins?

do you know where easter eggs come from (the dye tradition)

a very good book i suggest reading is the "two Babylons" gives a very excellent history of christian holy days and where they come from even down to what year the catholic church used their temporal power to make them christian

[Jennay]

I use a fake Christmas tree every year, and love giving gifts and getting into the spirit. I don't think Jesus gives a flying fuck if we attend church every Sunday, or if we eat meat on Fridays, or whatever. I'm sure he knows what's in our hearts and even if you broke one of the commandments, if you say you're sorry, truly and mean it, repent and all that shit.. he'll keep loving you. Or something.

I also celebrate Christmas time as if it's a huge birthday bash. Presents for everyone, and jubilee a plenty.

[Langston]

Dammuzi - you're missing the whole point... the Christians celebrate Christ's birth - not the Winter solstice. They celebrate the Resurrection - not the planting season...

Yes, the Church overlapped the pagan holiday - but they attempted to remake it - not emulate it.

[dammuzis]

so why doesnt the church keep the holy days that god set aside?
the ones that are commanded and that jesus himself kept?

didnt jesus say not to add anything or take anything away (or something)

[Narrock]

so why doesnt the church keep the holy days that god set aside?
the ones that are commanded and that jesus himself kept?

didnt jesus say not to add anything or take anything away (or something)

The Fourth Commandment states: "Remember the Sabbath Day, and keep it Holy." Seventh-Day Adventists go to church on the Sabbath (Saturday, although Sabbath is from sundown Friday to sundown Saturday). Most churches have their services on Sunday because it's been a tradition for such a long time. In A.D. 321 Emporer Constantine called Sunday, "The venerable day of the sun" and changed the official day of worship from Saturday, the true Bible Sabbath, to Sunday. Even Jesus prayed in the Synagogues on the Sabbath. Once again, Jesus knows our hearts. If we worship on Sunday, it's not because we believe in some pagan holiday, festival, or sun worship like Constantine did... It's because we're just used to it. Worshiping on Sunday is not forbidden in the Bible. If you're a Christian, you should be worshiping, praying, and talking to God every day... not just on the Sabbath. I go to church on the Sabbath and Sunday.

[dammuzis]

i have not been in a synagogue in over a year not many jews in southern oregon

anyway its about time this thread died, im kinda bored with it.

its sad to see that like every other christian i have met you think its ok that you break gods comandments because its whats always been done but dont let anyone else break the ones that you keep

oh one more thing to read up on

Hillel he was a jewish scholar that jesus pretty much repeated verbatim

[Narrock]

dammuzis sez:

its sad to see that like every other christian i have met you think its ok that you break gods comandments because its whats always been done but dont let anyone else break the ones that you keep

Do you obey all Ten Commandments 24/7?

[Tossica]

Uh, yeah and I am not even a christian

[dammuzis]

no mindia... i covet your ass

[Langston]

Judaism celebrates a whole different set of principles and events... to a Christian, Hannukah isn't in keeping with our beliefs... Why should we be waiting for the "master of the house" if we believe he's already been here? Hence, we celebrate Christ's birth and resurrection instead.

We're not "breaking his commandments"... we're breaking Jewish laws - but Christians aren't Jews... see?

[Apoco1]

ok i am going to post my view on this and i will recite back to the verse we all got pounded into us for years and years....John 3:16

it states that if you BELIEVE in Jesus that you will be saved. I have always taken the view that if i really earnestly try to be like a christian, then it will all turn out ok in the end. Sure, i may cuss from time to time and lie some too. I'm not saying i don't, but i do believe in Jesus, God, Holy Spirit and i do go to church, not out of habit, but to learn more about him and hear other people's views.

You can do what you want and call it "Christian". But when it comes down to it;
Do you TRULY believe in God?
are you firm in your faith?
have you taught someone about Jesus (that is just for me, not for everyone)
and, have you asked him into your heart and to forgive you?

In my personal opinion, if you have done any of these things - you will be ok.

God knows that we aren't perfect, He must accept that or else we are all f***ed.

[Langston]

There's a lot of wisdom in that Apoco.

[Apoco1]

i have thought about that alot...both when talking to agnostics and in prayer. just figured i would share a little bit of what i think

[Narrock]

ok i am going to post my view on this and i will recite back to the verse we all got pounded into us for years and years....John 3:16

it states that if you BELIEVE in Jesus that you will be saved. I have always taken the view that if i really earnestly try to be like a christian, then it will all turn out ok in the end. Sure, i may cuss from time to time and lie some too. I'm not saying i don't, but i do believe in Jesus, God, Holy Spirit and i do go to church, not out of habit, but to learn more about him and hear other people's views.

You can do what you want and call it "Christian". But when it comes down to it;
Do you TRULY believe in God?
are you firm in your faith?
have you taught someone about Jesus (that is just for me, not for everyone)
and, have you asked him into your heart and to forgive you?

In my personal opinion, if you have done any of these things - you will be ok.

God knows that we aren't perfect, He must accept that or else we are all f***ed.

That's very respectable and I do think you're right on principle I want to point out though that Catholics who bow down in front of a man with a long pointy hat, or bow down in front of Mary statues, and who confess their sins to a man(pretending to be God) in a little booth, etc. may be walking on thin ice (even though they believe in Jesus as their personal Savior) because they are doing things that God says not to do. That's all.

[Langston]

Mindia... that was all extremely ignorant...

People bow down to the Pope because he is a man of great holiness in the service of God. They bow to him out of respect - not out of worship.

People don't bow to Mary as a goddess... they ask her to pray for them - to intercede - due to her special relationship to God as the mother of the Son. Its like asking your pastor to pray for you... you're not asking him to directly answer your prayers - you're asking him to pray FOR you.

The priest does not "pretend to be God" during confession. He is there to be a councilor and voice for God. He prays for God to forgive you of your sins - he doesn't ever say that he, the priest, forgives you of sin - he doesn't have that authority and doesn't "pretend" to.

[Apoco1]

People bow down to the Pope because he is a man of great holiness in the service of God. They bow to him out of respect - not out of worship.

People don't bow to Mary as a goddess... they ask her to pray for them - to intercede - due to her special relationship to God as the mother of the Son. Its like asking your pastor to pray for you... you're not asking him to directly answer your prayers - you're asking him to pray FOR you.

The priest does not "pretend to be God" during confession. He is there to be a councilor and voice for God. He prays for God to forgive you of your sins - he doesn't ever say that he, the priest, forgives you of sin - he doesn't have that authority and doesn't "pretend" to.

exactly correct

[Kimona]

I think it's more him going from a womanizing pig to a bible thumping, "moral" crusader in less than a year.

Yeah.

The thing about Mindia (and no offense btw) is that he's completely inconsistent. Any old school NT troll or regular visitor of Toucher's board will be able to tell you that. Every woman he met was "the one", every problem in his life was earth shattering, every band he likes at the moment is the greatest in the world, blah blah blah. And 6 months from now there will be a new Mindia with just an uninteresting persona as this one.

Everyone needs attention. Some people choose to get it by stirring up message boards.

Again, no offense or anything. Just my opinion.

[Tacks]

In all seriousness, you are exactly right. He knows it is true too. Who knows, this could all be some charade he is playing on the internet just to pass the time. He's been at least 3 different people since he's started posting...pretty sad life. I'm sure he realizes this but has nobody except "God" to talk to because he's a psychopath.

[Narrock]

Mindia... that was all extremely ignorant...

People bow down to the Pope because he is a man of great holiness in the service of God. They bow to him out of respect - not out of worship.

People don't bow to Mary as a goddess... they ask her to pray for them - to intercede - due to her special relationship to God as the mother of the Son. Its like asking your pastor to pray for you... you're not asking him to directly answer your prayers - you're asking him to pray FOR you.

The priest does not "pretend to be God" during confession. He is there to be a councilor and voice for God. He prays for God to forgive you of your sins - he doesn't ever say that he, the priest, forgives you of sin - he doesn't have that authority and doesn't "pretend" to.

That's where I disagree with you Ugz. Keep in mind, I'm not trying to start a fight with you... I'm going to say my peace on this subject and I won't go round and round in circles with you on this. I think your Catholic roots are fuzzing-up your ability to be objective here

The pope is not a man of great holiness in the service of God. Yes, he is a humanitarian, he is full of "good works" and has a good heart... just like Mother Theresa. But he believes he is living the life of Jesus here on earth. I'm not going to debate this because I know it to be fact. He is a blasphemer of unparalled proportions.

Now about Mary and Mariology... Yes, she was the earthly Mother of our Lord Jesus and she deserves every bit of respect we have in us to give. But to bow down and pray to a statue of Mary is idolatry. Pure and simple. God forbids this. It is extremely different than kneeling down, bowing down, etc. and praying before a cross, which is the symbol of our Lord's sacrifice.

Say what you want about confession. The Bible says to confess your sins to God and ask for forgiveness. Nowhere in the Bible, Old or New Testament, does it say to use 3rd-party intervention when confessing your sins to God. Are Catholics that spiritually weak that they need such a crutch? That's pretty sad.

[Langston]

WTF... dude... Let me try this one more time...

The Pope is the spiritual leader of the Catholic Church. He most certainly IS in the service of God.... I'm not exactly sure what you mean by "he believes he is living the life of Jesus here on earth" - but I think, judging from the rest of your comments that this means he's "pretending" to be Christ reincarnate - which is 100% untrue and quite stupid to even suggest.

No Catholic worships Mary... are there cults out there that do? Probably - but they aren't Catholic. No one is praying TO Mary... let me quote the most often used intercession to Mary: "Holy Mary, Mother of God, Pray for us sinners"... no where there does it say "Mary - bless us" or "Mary give us..."... it is an intercession to someone to pray for us. It is NOT idolatry in even the loosest sense.

No where in the Bible does it say one must confess their sins to a human. You are right. However, does it make it WRONG to do so? Consider it be therapy for your religion... people see counselors to discuss what is wrong in their relationships, or careers, or finances... what's wrong with discussing your religious issues with a third party? It's no more of a crutch than someone who uses counciling for their marriage.

Mindia - stop being ignorant.

[Tossica]

Ugzug sez:

"Mindia - stop being ignorant."


Hahahahahaha, OMFG! LMAO! ROFL! LOLZ!

That is some funny shit.

[Narrock]

The sad part is that he doesn't even know his own religion.

[Tossica]

The sad part is that he doesn't even know his own religion.

No... the sad part is that you think that's the sad part.

[Narrock]

The sad part is that he doesn't even know his own religion.

No... the sad part is that you think that's the sad part.

No, the sad part is that I know a few Catholics, and I've researched Catholicism and I know what the truth is. It's hard for a die-hard Catholic to swallow their pride and not let their ego get in the way of the truth. I grew up as a Lutheran. If I thought Lutherans were right then I'd be ranting and raving about them. But I don't, so that's why I've chosen a non-denominational Christian church. They don't teach anything that's not in the Bible. Catholics do. So do Lutherans. So do Mormons and a few others.