Hey Tossica...

[Tikker]

An individual who breaks a law that conscience tells him is unjust, and who willingly accepts the penalty of imprisonment in order to arouse the conscience of the community over its injustice, is in reality expressing the highest respect for the law.

fucking bullshit

that's the biggest cop out I've ever heard in my life



by your rationale, if I don't agree with any law it's a-OK to just go ahead and do it my way

like, let's say that I decide rapists should be castrated, and feel it's unjust that they just get prison. am I really expressing respect for the law by going out and castrating the dude on my own? (granted, a lot of people would probably secretly applaud the action)


law = law

99% of the arbitrary (legal age for drinking/sex/etc for example) and just because you personally don't agree with the particular law does not mean you're somehow entitled to just ignore it

[The Kizzy]

I should also add that I have a hard time being around pot when I can't smoke it.

i'm the same way with cigerettes

[Jay]

An individual who breaks a law that conscience tells him is unjust, and who willingly accepts the penalty of imprisonment in order to arouse the conscience of the community over its injustice, is in reality expressing the highest respect for the law.

fucking bullshit

that's the biggest cop out I've ever heard in my life



by your rationale, if I don't agree with any law it's a-OK to just go ahead and do it my way

like, let's say that I decide rapists should be castrated, and feel it's unjust that they just get prison. am I really expressing respect for the law by going out and castrating the dude on my own? (granted, a lot of people would probably secretly applaud the action)


law = law

99% of the arbitrary (legal age for drinking/sex/etc for example) and just because you personally don't agree with the particular law does not mean you're somehow entitled to just ignore it

You forgot the last part of that Tikk. If you go out and castrate a rapist because you believe you should knowing that you will be punished by the law for it and you willingly accept your punishment then thats how you are respecting the law. If you take it into your own hands and happily accept punishment you are respecting the law.

[Gargamellow]

First ask who makes the law and why it is made. Then judge the law.

I don't care if you guys want to use my posts to argue about the legalization of pot. I rather enjoy these debates.

See ya:P

[Tacks]

First ask who makes the law and why it is made. Then judge the law.

I don't care if you guys want to use my posts to argue about the legalization of pot. I rather enjoy these debates.

See ya:P

How does it matter whatsoever who made what law and for why? There is nothing you can do to change it after you've committed the crime. You know it's illegal yet you do it anyways, pay the price.

How exactly is the common citizen to "judge a law" that's just ridiculous.

[Harrison]

First ask who makes the law and why it is made. Then judge the law.

I don't care if you guys want to use my posts to argue about the legalization of pot. I rather enjoy these debates.

See ya:P

How does it matter whatsoever who made what law and for why? There is nothing you can do to change it after you've committed the crime. You know it's illegal yet you do it anyways, pay the price.

How exactly is the common citizen to "judge a law" that's just ridiculous.

It matters a lot.

[Tacks]

Not after the fact is my point. It does not matter one bit who or why made it or how fucking stupid the law is or how stupid YOU think it is, it's still a law that we're all to abide by. I don't mean to say that it is right or wrong, it's out of our hands at that point.

So no, unless it's afterwards deemed unconstitutional, it matters not at all.

Now if you want to go about changing the law or whatever that's fine but until then you still must play by the rules or face the consequences.

[10sun]

How about it is just bad parenting to be exposing them to and accepting of people with drug problems?

[ClakarEQ]

Taxx, do you go into the court room every day you speed 5mph over the speed limit. You sure sound self-rightous, do you do anything wrong or are you god like?

Some laws are stupid, shouldn't exist, are not complied with, and are not enforced. However by your post, there isn't a bad law on the books.

Laws are a set of rules put in place/removed by society, and enforced by the judicial system. You aren't required to follow the law, you're asked to and if you don't you may pay a price, not you will, but may.

I don't know one person, including the entire posting body on NT, who does not break laws, not one, you and tikker included. However your choice to break the law, in your mind, is different than mine. For you it is ok to speed, even though you endanger far more than I, but for others to break the law, o heavens no.

[Tacks]

You're a fucking moron and need to learn how to read.

Slowly, go over my post again it look what I wrote. Make sure you're not baked when doing so.

If you don't understand what I was saying by the second time then you're just being a defensive douchebag to try to justify you being a weak individual because of your addiction.

Once again for you, I'm sorry you're not a strong enough person to go through life without mind altering drugs.



Show me in any one of my posts I said a single thing with it being ok to break the law, or even referenced myself whatsoever, quit going off on tangents.

[ClakarEQ]

Taxx, call me what you will as it makes no difference to me, but know you are no better than I contrary to your personal opinion. I'm fully expecting this sort of post from you, and I expect another just like it.

I will however respond to your post, even though you're unable to answer mine

You said that I don't make the rules.
You said that if you break the law you pay the price.
You said it doesn't matter how stupid the law is, you must follow it.
You said that if you do any type of drug and are over 18, you're a loser.

Is this correct?

Now you show me where I defeneded smoking pot or attempted to justify it? Please include some name calling so you'll meet my expectations as well.

[Tacks]

Holy shit you are dense. Please explain how your previous post relates WHATSOEVER to what I posted in the entire thread and then we can continue from there.

Otherwise I'm wasting my time because you can't see past the point that you smoke pot and think it's ok.

[Jay]

Kmart

[Gargamellow]

Thinking that someone is less intelligent than yourself for having different values and beliefs is just very sad. If anything, the open mind is the more intelligent one.

Name calling is not the way to have a discussion.

[Tikker]

Taxx, do you go into the court room every day you speed 5mph over the speed limit. You sure sound self-rightous, do you do anything wrong or are you god like?

Some laws are stupid, shouldn't exist, are not complied with, and are not enforced. However by your post, there isn't a bad law on the books.

that's not what he said at all

just because you as a druggie don't agree with anti-drug laws does not mean that you're right, or even that the majority agrees with you

you disagree, that's fine. but no whining and bitching if you get wtfpwned for smoking up

if you want to legally work towards getting the law changed, go for it

until then, you're breaking the law everytime you smoke up

[Tacks]

Thanks Dr. Phil but the adults are talking here.

[ClakarEQ]

Tik.

You know it's illegal yet you do it anyways, pay the price.

all I said is that you should do the same.

You both attempt to turn this into a pot thing, this isn't about pot, so apparently you both are missing the boat.

This was about law. This was about breaking the law. This was you saying I break the law, and I do, I fully admited this in my second post. My point was to prove that you are breaking the law as well, but you're both too chicken shit to admit it. Funny thing is, you've actually proven my point in my second post. You're upset because I'm ok with breaking the law /chuckle

I'm out for now though, my day is done, I'll check back tomorrow to see where this went

[Tikker]

I don't speed tho~

ps, why would i be upset that you're ok with breaking the law? I just have no respect for pot smokers

[Tacks]

Tik.

You know it's illegal yet you do it anyways, pay the price.

all I said is that you should do the same.

You both attempt to turn this into a pot thing, this isn't about pot, so apparently you both are missing the boat.

This was about law. This was about breaking the law. This was you saying I break the law, and I do, I fully admited this in my second post. My point was to prove that you are breaking the law as well, but you're both too chicken shit to admit it. Funny thing is, you've actually proven my point in my second post. You're upset because I'm ok with breaking the law /chuckle

I'm out for now though, my day is done, I'll check back tomorrow to see where this went

Holy fuck you ARE that stupid. Here I'll spell it out for you.


THIS THREAD IS NOT ABOUT YOU OR ME, YOU ARE NOT IMPORTANT, QUIT MAKING THE THREAD ABOUT YOU.

It's about breaking the law, any law, period.

[Arlos]

Unjust laws exist: shall we be content to obey them, or shall we endeavor to amend them, and obey them until we have succeeded, or shall we transgress them at once? Men, generally, under such a government as this, think that they ought to wait until they have persuaded the majority to alter them. They think that, if they should resist, the remedy would be worse than the evil. But it is the fault of the government itself that the remedy is worse than the evil. It makes it worse. Why is it not more apt to anticipate and provide for reform? Why does it not cherish its wise minority? Why does it cry and resist before it is hurt? Why does it not encourage its citizens to put out its faults, and do better than it would have them? Why does it always crucify Christ and excommunicate Copernicus and Luther, and pronounce Washington and Franklin rebels?

One would think, that a deliberate and practical denial of its authority was the only offense never contemplated by its government; else, why has it not assigned its definite, its suitable and proportionate, penalty? If a man who has no property refuses but once to earn nine shillings for the State, he is put in prison for a period unlimited by any law that I know, and determined only by the discretion of those who put him there; but if he should steal ninety times nine shillings from the State, he is soon permitted to go at large again.

If the injustice is part of the necessary friction of the machine of government, let it go, let it go: perchance it will wear smooth--certainly the machine will wear out. If the injustice has a spring, or a pulley, or a rope, or a crank, exclusively for itself, then perhaps you may consider whether the remedy will not be worse than the evil; but if it is of such a nature that it requires you to be the agent of injustice to another, then I say, break the law. Let your life be a counter-friction to stop the machine. What I have to do is to see, at any rate, that I do not lend myself to the wrong which I condemn.

The same philosopher puts it a bit more succinctly:

Under a government which imprisons unjustly, the true place for a just man is also a prison

To translate for the short attention span crowd, his argument is that when you see an unjust law, breaking the law is the ONLY right thing, and indeed the moral thing to do.

Bonus points to anyone who recognizes the philosopher. As a hint, he was an American.

-Arlos

[10sun]

Thoreau or however you spell his name. np.

[Tikker]

for the retarded out there


You personally disagreeing with a law doesn't make it an unjust law

[Harrison]

What would constitute unjust? Majority?

That makes no sense.

[Tikker]

:ugh:

What would constitute unjust? Majority?

That makes no sense.

listening to what the invisible man tells you is right/wrong doesn't make much sense either

you're mostly missing the point tho

how do you define just/unjust?

[Trielelvan]

Tik.

You know it's illegal yet you do it anyways, pay the price.

all I said is that you should do the same.

You both attempt to turn this into a pot thing, this isn't about pot, so apparently you both are missing the boat.

This was about law. This was about breaking the law. This was you saying I break the law, and I do, I fully admited this in my second post. My point was to prove that you are breaking the law as well, but you're both too chicken shit to admit it. Funny thing is, you've actually proven my point in my second post. You're upset because I'm ok with breaking the law /chuckle

I'm out for now though, my day is done, I'll check back tomorrow to see where this went

I think what you're missing here Clak is that Taxx is not talking about the word of the law generally speaking in everyday life.
Amanda asked a question, and his answer pertains to that.
If she is going to run for political office later down the line, will her current associations affect her later in some way?
The answer he is giving is "yes" - not because he agrees with the letter of the law necessarily (that is neither here nor there), but because it is what it is at this present time, and there is nothing anyone can do to change that, so if she is doing something that = breaking the law, then it is, in fact, breaking the law, like it or not, and that will color her character with regards to her future.
He's not saying that the law is good or bad, has worth or doesn't - the law, once made, is there until it isn't, and if it's broken, there is a price to pay for breaking it. He is stating fact - not opinion.