Rex Grossman finally benched

[Jay]

I really hope Griese doesn't mail it in like Rex does. Anyone seen mofish btw?

[Tikker]

at some point, football people have to start picking good quarterbacks, rather than guys who have physical tools and assume they can teach them how to be good QB's

[Arlos]

Yep. Remember, Joe Montana went in the 3rd round, because "He didn't have enough arm strength to be a successful Quarterback."

Now, given their prime of physical abilities, who would YOU rather have as QB for your team:

A) Joe Montana

B) Jeff George




-Arlos

[Tikker]

Brady went in the 7th round I think

another good example would be Doug Flutie

won everywhere he went, but everybody just saw 5'9 and decided he was too small to throw a football

[Xaiveir]

Brady went in the 7th round I think

another good example would be Doug Flutie

won everywhere he went, but everybody just saw 5'9 and decided he was too small to throw a football

Sixth round pick but deffinatly a good point, along with the Flutie statement.

[Harrison]

Man wouldn't you feel fucking stupid for passing him up?

Same with every great player in the past decade passed up in the draft, even into the double digits.

[Xaiveir]

Man wouldn't you feel fucking stupid for passing him up?

Same with every great player in the past decade passed up in the draft, even into the double digits.

Eh not really. You can second guess all you want, there is no gaurantees that Brady would have turned into an elite quarterback in another situation, or even in another system. He is a product of the system he is in.

That is not criticizing Brady, because the guy is one helluva quarterback.

[Harrison]

Well, I think in the AFC he would have just wtfpwnt either way. MAYBE not in the NFC...

Though this is all speculation...

[Xaiveir]

Certainly.

There was a reason he was not even a starter in college, but split time there at Michigan. There was a reason he was drafted in the 6th round.

Alot of it goes to the fact that Brady worked his ass off, and did not give up. Also the fact that he was ready when he replaced Bledsoe, speaks volumes for his character and work ethic. Who knows if under a different coach(s), he would have done those things.

Think if Green Bay would have picked him. He would still be backing up Favre.

[Lyion]

Everything is situational in the NFL. That said there are QBs that are going to succeed. Manning means more to the Colts than Brady does to the Pats.

Brady benefits from being in a killer situation, and walking into a team that was playoff calibre, with great coaching, and even better SIGINT. Put Brady behind New Orleans or Chicago's O line this year and he's another ok QB on a subpar team. Put Manning on either team and it's a different story.

[Arlos]

And even I don't deny that Montana was helped by the system he landed in. He probably would not have been as good in a traditional vertical passing offense. Elway or Marino, for example, were far superior fits for such offenses, since both had cannons for arms. Nevertheless, I still think he'd have done well there, because of his accuracy and decision making. And still, if I had one game I had to win, and could pick any QB from whenever in his prime, I'd take Montana, hands down.

Oh, and I concur about Manning to the Colts. He *IS* that offense. He's one of the only QBs in the league who's freely allowed to call his own plays and audible at will, like QBs used to do. If he went down with a major injury, the Colts would be an 8-8 team, tops.

-Arlos

[Lyion]

Montana had ice water in his veins, and read D's better than anyone in his time. He is a clutch player.

If I had to have a guy face Buddy Ryan's 46 D, stare down nasty blitzes, and win, regardless of the talent around him, then Montana would be that guy. A lot of the reason so many 49ers are considered elite players is Montana's execution of the west coast offense.

However, Montana in his prime is not as scary as Manning in his prime. Manning does not and never has had the O Line Montana and Brady have enjoyed, nor the elite D both enjoyed, but still single handedly has won games. Manning is probably the best QB to ever play the game.

However, in the clutch, Manning is not as good as Montana. Nobody ever is or has been.

[Tikker]

Everything is situational in the NFL.

there's so many guys who could have been awesome if they'd been put in the right situation

[Diekan]

Keeping in mind that coaches and staff aren't exactly rocket scientists either.

Two words - John Madden.

[Tikker]

Keeping in mind that coaches and staff aren't exactly rocket scientists either.

Two words - John Madden.

well

John Madden has the best winning percentage of any coach in the hall of fame

being articulate isn't necessarily the best way to judge how good a coach is

[Evermore]

I really hope Griese doesn't mail it in like Rex does. Anyone seen mofish btw?

Griese is no different. he is just older. both are shitty QB's

I hear they are looking to sign Ryan Leaf....

[Tikker]

I don't think Griese is that bad actually

he sometimes holds the ball too long, bledsoe stylez, but isn't nearly as prone to stupid throws

[Reynaldo]

The problem with Rex is he tried to make too many 20+ yard throws / plays. Stretching the defense only works if you can complete stuff like that regularly.

I think Griese will be in more of a 3 downs to get 10 yards guy instead of trying for big plays all the time, which should help the offense and help to keep the defense off the field some.

[Lyion]

Griese has a Wuerffel rubber band arm. Grossman has a gun.

The problem wasn't Grossman, it was the shitty O play, line play, and asshat WR's incorrectly running routes.

Every INT Grossman threw this year has been due to WR fuckup or him getting hit by a D-lineman. I've watched every Bears game this year. While Rex ain't Peyton, he is getting a ton of flak for his offense sucking. QBs are dependent on everyone else.

Griese will enable them to stack even more in the box since he can't hit that 25 yard out on a line like Grossman can.

Fortunately they aren't playing the Chargers or Patriots anymore, but it still might be a long year for the Bears, and they are completely not viable with Griese going into the playoffs.

[Evermore]

Every INT Grossman threw this year has been due to WR fuckup or him getting hit by a D-lineman. I've watched every Bears game this year

There were a few he thru the ball knowing he was going to be hit and should have just taken the sack. the offence getting on track has to start with the QB he is leading after all. Grossman is unable to do so and has actually regressed according to his numbers. there is no possible way you can say it isnt his fault. while the whole thing isnt his fault he has a HUGE part in it and has proven he isnt up to the task. I am wondering now if he gets resigned. this is the last year of his contract on top of it all.

he is getting a ton of flak for his offense sucking

2 words

Dan Marino

[Lyion]

I've watched every Chicago game this year. Grossman is not the bigger problem. Berrian stopping on routes and causing INTs is doubly so. Likewise, there have been a lot of drops, and he often has zero time in the pocket. 90% of the time Grossman's decision making has been good. Go watch the tapes of the games.

A lot of that may be due to playing the Pats & Chargers, but I feel the guy is getting a bad rap.

Also, remember watching Marino play the rough NFC teams in the 80s, Ever? He sure looked a lot like Grossman playing New England and San Diego.

[Tikker]

I've watched every Chicago game this year. Grossman is not the bigger problem. Berrian stopping on routes and causing INTs is doubly so. Likewise, there have been a lot of drops, and he often has zero time in the pocket. 90% of the time Grossman's decision making has been good.

I kinda agree

his decision making this season has been alright, and most of his picks have been the receiver quitting on him

that being said, he hasn't done anything to inspire confidence for the receivers

[Evermore]

Also, remember watching Marino play the rough NFC teams in the 80s, Ever? He sure looked a lot like Grossman playing New England and San Diego.

yes i do. Marino looked nothing like Grossman, not even close. Especially when the dolphins were the only team to beat the championship season bears or while he was setting NFL league passing records as a rookie or becomming the 1st QB to pass for more then 4k yards. I actually watched some of those games.

http://www.miamidolphins.com/newsite/history/historicalhighlights/historicalhighlights3.asp#1981 play around there and you'll get a better picture.


Lyion you cant pull Grossman out of the line of fire. He is(was) the team leader and his team is sucking. He has done nothing to try and change it that anyone can see. It may be a raw deal but thats the hand dealt. He is not cutting it period. no way to argue it. thou the blame should be spread abit as Lovey should be taking some real heat for this too.

[Tikker]

I don't think Rex has been as bad as his numbers this year tho

3 of the picks that I can think of off the top of my head were 100% WR fault, and lots of really well thrown balls have been dropped (mostly by Berrian)

add in that they aren't running the ball nearly as effectively as last year, and it's just a recipe for disaster

stick Roethlisberger in Chicago, and Grossman in Pittsburgh, and I bet the teams records wouldn't have changed

[Tacks]

I disagree, Grossman's problem is that he sucks under pressure, it's partly the O-line's fault for sucking and partly his fault because he just folds under pressure. Look at someone else with a shitty offensive line that still does well, Roethlesberger...Grossman just sucks when anyone is coming at him at all, he's just a mediocre QB.