Occupy Wall Street

[Gypsiyee]

I think protest corgi should probably start a Protest Food Bowl movement instead. I mean I know corgis are husky and thick by nature, but that looks like one chubby puppy!

[leah]

ya he was kind of a porker, hehe. i'd say about half the corgis i see are overweight. bums me out. on friday the vet said my girl is underweight (though we've put three pounds on her since we got her--she was skin and bones when we adopted her! still have a ways to go i guess) and my boy is perfect, though the boy has been close to chubbytown from time to time, hehe.

[araby]

Bill Maher says we should be blaming Wall Street. I can only pay 50% attention to him, so I don't know what is really going on. I realize Brinstar has explained, but I still don't understand cause he talks with such big words. I get lost. Truly, it sounds like people are disagreeing, like they don't really know for sure but they are sure that they *think* they know. So, what is the problem again? Who is to blame? bottom line...

[Spazz]

Are you fuckin stoned ?

[araby]

does anyone have a clear response?

[Spazz]

Araby,this is what the wall street thing is about. This is a statement about what started it.



This is a statement from the protesters being read.

[araby]

thanks Spazz.

[Arlos]

Big Words? Really?

OK, I'm just going to go watch more football now, lest I break my own recently highlighted rules... rofl.

-Arlos

[araby]

yeah, I had to watch the videos twice to make sure I understood through the jargon what is going on. that makes you feel like being mean to me? you're cool! and so smart!!

on topic-I have a question about the violence that was mentioned in the videos. what was that about, how did it start?

[Zanchief]

Bill Maher says we should be blaming Wall Street. I can only pay 50% attention to him, so I don't know what is really going on. I realize Brinstar has explained, but I still don't understand cause he talks with such big words. I get lost. Truly, it sounds like people are disagreeing, like they don't really know for sure but they are sure that they *think* they know. So, what is the problem again? Who is to blame? bottom line...

Brinstar has done a great job talking around in circles, but he still hasn't addressed the fact that this isn't Wall Street issue at all. These people remind of those G8 protestors. They seem very passionate, but there cause is nonsense.

Lyion, just an aside, I think the divide between blue color and white color isn't as big as you think. I know a lot of people who work in the trades and I don't know anyone who looks down on them. It's a very profitable industry and with all these reno shows running 24/7 it seems to be an industry that is gaining steam. I don't think your opinion that people feel too entitled to do these jobs is accurate at all.

[Narrock]

Bill Maher is a huge asshole, he's insane, he's 99% wrong on political issues, AND he fails at humor.

[Lyion]

Lyion, just an aside, I think the divide between blue color and white color isn't as big as you think. I know a lot of people who work in the trades and I don't know anyone who looks down on them. It's a very profitable industry and with all these reno shows running 24/7 it seems to be an industry that is gaining steam. I don't think your opinion that people feel too entitled to do these jobs is accurate at all.

I think most people do not feel there is a divide. I certainly do not. I have friends who are blue collar workers.

My point was more about the protests and people who feel they are entitled to a job in a career of their choosing, where they want it, and do indeed look down on blue collar careers for them.

In regards to Olbermann and the video, I find it a bit funny progressives here looking to define a movement against the 1% are using a posh multi-millionaire to voice their concerns.

[Spazz]

In regards to Olbermann and the video, I find it a bit funny progressives here looking to define a movement against the 1% are using a posh multi-millionaire to voice their concerns

Its something that right wingers dont get because it doesnt go with what they believe. Liberals are not against people with money or being rich. They are against extreme greed , tax loopholes and cutting the social safety net. You dont take a vow of poverty when you become a liberal .

[Spazz]

Araby this isnt hard to understand. Walk out your front door and you can see why people are pissed off. Lotta folks are out of work, lot of folks dont have healthcare and a lot of folks lost a ton of money to the whole wall street melt down.

As far as violence goes wherever you have a large group of protesters and police together shit is going to happen. What you do need to keep in mind though is that only one side shows up in armor armed to the teeth.

[araby]

what I've come to understand is that unless you own a home or a 401K the problem with Wall Street doesn't affect you. is that correct? I know that personally I did not lose anything in that because I have neither.

but- I don't have healthcare- and I don't understand how that is a Wall Street issue.

I'm not unemployed, but I know people are- and again- not sure how that's a Wall Street issue.

sidenote: my comment about Brinstar's big words was not an insult, I enjoy his writing very much. I've just been out of touch with political goings on for a while and am trying to catch up.

[araby]

In regards to Olbermann and the video, I find it a bit funny progressives here looking to define a movement against the 1% are using a posh multi-millionaire to voice their concerns.

to be fair, Olbermann was pretty angry on August 1st, before the movement ever became organized. just watching him talk on that first video Spazz posted got *me* riled up. I'm not sure they are using Olbermann, since he first aired concerns about the whole thing prior to the movement. He seems genuinely sickened by the money being used to put people in office, etc...

[Lyion]

When hasn't Olbermann been angry? He also is the antithesis of Krauthammer whom I linked who is accurate with facts, and does not play loose and hard and demagogue every issue like Ketih does.

Spazz, most people on both sides of the aisle are for reforming the tax code to be more fair, ensuring social security and medicare are sustainable, and against overt corporate greed. The problem is what did the Dems do when they had a filibuster-proof majority and control of the executive branch and could pass anything they wanted? Take a gander at Goldman-Sachs, hedge funds owners, GE, and most of the other biggest entities on Wall Street. They are not bastions of GOP backers.

I still haven't seen a good definition of what the OWL movement is about except from a guy nobody in news, not even MSNBC, takes serious, and who is just an overtly nasty piece of work that makes Rush Limbaugh look non-partisan. He also is a part of the 1%.....

[Spazz]

Well lyion Its pretty obvious to me that the democrats arent really liberal. I think both parties are more alike than different. They talk the talking points to rile up they bases but they never do anything good for working people.

Im pretty liberal on most issues but I am not a democrat. Im sure myself and brinstar and several others out there feel taken for granted. Well vote for the D even though we hate them because republicans seem worse. It blows my mind to hear all this talk of socialism the democrats are more conservative than they have ever been and the republicans are even further to the right. I keep holding my nose and voting thinking maybe these cock suckers will do something good for the people and i keep getting more and more disappointed and jaded.

It looks to me like my choices are going to be a weak leader, an insane crackpot neo confederate or a flip flopper who believes in magic underwear. G wiz guys I cant wait to get out there and be a patriot and vote. Reminds me of that old saying with friends like you who needs enemies.

Im just pissed at politics in america and the way things have been going my entire life. Im pissed that we cant get together and decide on what reality is and im pissed that we the people have the world in common but are devided by such trivial shit as queers , pot and jesus.

I want to see some insane compromises going on. Like you can have all the guns you want and carry them wherever but we are making pot legal. You can pay little to no taxes ever again but you have to make your products in america as cleanly as possible. Homos can get married but the 10 commandments have to be put up in every school and courthouse.Well make jesus riding on an eagle carrying 7 american flags our countries national mascot but the rich have to pay more taxes. Fuck it man lets see if we can make people as free/happy/ and uncomfortable as possible. I just really want to see some major changes in our country and see if trying some different things works any better than our current ways.

rant over

[leah]

point of order, spazz, though i basically agree with you any other time: brinstar doesn't vote D; he usually votes green.

[Spazz]

How you like my compromises ?

[brinstar]

Bill Maher says we should be blaming Wall Street. I can only pay 50% attention to him, so I don't know what is really going on. I realize Brinstar has explained, but I still don't understand cause he talks with such big words. I get lost. Truly, it sounds like people are disagreeing, like they don't really know for sure but they are sure that they *think* they know. So, what is the problem again? Who is to blame? bottom line...

Brinstar has done a great job talking around in circles, but he still hasn't addressed the fact that this isn't Wall Street issue at all.

this might be a better way to illustrate why this started AT wall street:

let's say you have a small fishing village on the shore of a lake, and the lake is fed by a stream. one day, unbeknownst to the villagers, a huge rock falls near the stream and smashes open a small pocket of Texas Tea that happened to be near the surface, which starts seeping into the stream. no one notices at first, because it's only a small trickle entering the stream and it becomes invisible by the time it reaches the lake.

but as time passes, fish start dying, the people start getting sick, and the fishing livelihood tanks (haw, fishtank, get it?). the village starts to get alarmed that their lake is fouled, and everyone's arguing what to do about it but nothing is working. then finally, a handful of young people who are worried about their village and their families and their neighbors decide to try following the stream up hill. lo! and behold, they find an oil trickle polluting and contaminating the stream and thus the lake, causing all the villagers undue hardship.

yelling at the lake doesn't do any good, and nothing the people can come up with manages to unpollute the lake. meanwhile, the people who went upstream keep hollering about the oil trickle (loud enough for the village to hear) and how it's responsible for the pollution of the lake and the downturn of the local fishing economy and the hardships of the people, but the villagers mostly don't listen because come on - that lake has been around forever and it's always taken care of them before, and they'd rather keep trying to fix the lake using methods that aren't working at all.

the lake cannot heal until the trickle is stopped.

[brinstar]

and for the record, say whatever you want about Olbermann (and IMO you'd be wrong) but it's idiotic to disparage the video where he's simply fucking reading OWS's statement on air

find a clip of glenn beck reading the statement with a flat affect and the words will have just as much meaning


oh and while i'm recapping:

Bill Maher is a huge asshole, he's insane, he's 99% wrong on political issues, AND he fails at humor.

agreed, maybe, more like 40%, agreed

The problem is what did the Dems do when they had a filibuster-proof majority and control of the executive branch and could pass anything they wanted? Take a gander at Goldman-Sachs, hedge funds owners, GE, and most of the other biggest entities on Wall Street. They are not bastions of GOP backers.

they did fuck-all. it seems like you're assuming that the OWS movement is supportive of Democrats? that the movement somehow exempts them from the accusations of corruptions? i'll grant you that there are certainly those within the movement who believe the Democrats can right the ship, but there are also a large number of participants who'd rather see Ron Paul give it a shot. i belong in neither of those camps, personally - and officially the OWS movement endorses no party, candidate, or bill. we have a privately-held government, and that has to change.

[Zanchief]

the lake cannot heal until the trickle is stopped.

Let me do better.

Village, oil, lake, young people. They notice the oil spilling into the river that feeds into their lake. They could try and block the oil from leaking into the river, or they can have a rally to try and stop the way water pours down the river into there village. The water will never change, it has been that way, and always will be that way. The only way to stop the oil from seeping into the lake is to block the oil spill, not to try and change the way water behaves.

[Lyion]

[araby]

The patient I just saw worked on WS for years and he's retired now. He spent ten minutes explaining to me his view of what's going on and his bottom line was this-

banks/lenders gave mortgages to people for virtually no down payment and 2% interest based on a default rate, on what they predicted people would do. rich, middle class and poor took advantage of this. of course the poor and middle class took advantage because now they could afford to buy. the rich took advantage in order to flip houses to turn profit. (I think there is a movie that's about this-have no idea the name of it. I keep seeing it on HBO)

ultimately the collapse was due to personal irresponsibility and has nothing to do with WS or Obama or any other one entity. He said sure, there are wrong doings and politicians should not be bought, but that's got nothing to do with WS, either.

I could never remember/repeat every single thing he said because I'm a dental assistant and I don't use or know the language. But honestly, he told me what I already knew and that was that no one really is pointing the finger in the proper direction, because no one ever wants to accept responsibility for their own actions. from the poor buying homes they couldn't afford to the rich being greedy and flipping houses like crazy for profit-the fact that EVERYONE did it is what contributed to the problem. He says WS is not to blame for the problems people are having today. /shrug

he worked there. he has nothing to gain talking to me, I just show him how to floss his bridge.