Drill baby Drill

[Narrock]

Corny slogan I know, but... (from Wikipedia)

Petroleum production in Canada is a major industry which is important to the economy of North America. Canada is the sixth largest oil producing country in the world. In 2008 it produced an average of 438,000 cubic metres per day (2,750,000 bbl/d) of crude oil, crude bitumen and natural gas condensate. Of that amount, 45% was conventional crude oil, 49.5% was bitumen from oil sands, and 5.5% was condensate from natural gas wells.[1] Most of Canadian petroleum production, approximately 283,000 cubic metres per day (1,780,000 bbl/d), was exported, almost all of it to the United States.[2] Canada is the largest single source of oil imports into the United States.

The petroleum industry in Canada is also referred to as the Canadian "Oil Patch"; the term refers especially to upstream operations (exploration and production of oil and gas), and to a lesser degree to downstream operations (refining, distribution, and selling of oil and gas products). In 2005, almost 25,000 new oil wells were spud (drilled) in Canada. Daily, over 100 new wells are spud in the province of Alberta alone [3].

So why again can't we setup a modern drilling rig off the coast of Alaska IN ONE OF THE BIGGEST OIL DEPOSITS IN THE WORLD and DRILL OUR WAY OUT OF THIS RECESSION? Oh yeah, the environmental wackos. We wouldn't want another gulf oil disaster hurrrrrrrr. So by deductive reasoning, one can deduce that the EPA is the main cause of us continuing on this recession. Hell, Canada drilled it's way out their recession decades ago. Why can't we learn from that? We already know that building a drilling rig and refinery in Alaska will only look like a "postage stamp on a football field." I mean c'mon, let's do it. The environmentalists were kicking and screaming about the Alaska pipeline, which we know now is crucial for the moose and elk populations who make their nests under the pipe for warmth.

Oh, and please respond with something more intelligent than "Dude, you're a fucking idiot" or other such nonsense. State your position and support it, thanks.

[Tikker]

I'd love it if you guys would drill your own oil and be less dependent on ours

then we could keep our oil, and sell it cheaper locally, rather than for the inflated price you pay for it

[araby]

I find it interesting that earlier when I watched an episode of The Muppet Show (late 70's) the guest on the show referenced an oil shortage. hmm....

[Narrock]

I'd love it if you guys would drill your own oil and be less dependent on ours

then we could keep our oil, and sell it cheaper locally, rather than for the inflated price you pay for it

Looking at it from Canada's perspective, they'd have to find a new customer then to replace the U.S. as their main oil importer if they want their economy to stay robust. That's a win-win right there.

[Tossica]

I think you overlook something big here. Opening up new drilling will only make more profit for the oil companies. It won't do anything for the economy or for the price of gas at the pump. Crude is selling for less than it did a year ago yet we're paying over $1 more per gallon at the pump. Fuck big oil.

[Narrock]

I think you overlook something big here. Opening up new drilling will only make more profit for the oil companies. It won't do anything for the economy or for the price of gas at the pump. Crude is selling for less than it did a year ago yet we're paying over $1 more per gallon at the pump. Fuck big oil.

Well the whole idea is to make it so that the end-result would be like a buck a gallon (at the most). We also wouldn't be stuffing our greenbacks in the pockets of oil sheiks in the middle east. Have congress make a law that would prevent the oil company from somehow crooking the books (surprise audits) and pulling shenanigans... to minimize the opportunity for corruption.

[Tikker]

Well the whole idea is to make it so that the end-result would be like a buck a gallon (at the most).

the part you don't get is that now that the price is $XX it will never get back down to just $X

never


simple as that


people have proven that they will continue to pay $XX, and the companies will continue to charge it


if you want dollar gallon, you need the governement to take over ALL oil, and then sell it for a buck

that's the only way it'll happen

[Lyion]

Once technology get's to the point where most of our auto's are not gas turbine, oil will plummet in value. Even if it goes slower, changes in second and third world countries will lower the value over time.

Oil is a huge bubble based on the fact it's so readily available but so steeply inflated by speculation and OPEC. I can see a barrel of oil falling back down to 20 dollars again in the next ten years. It's not a matter of if, just when.

[Arlos]

That and the fact that domestic oil drilling in no way means lower costs domestically. There is nothing whatsoever that in any way mandates oil companies that drill oil in the US to SELL the oil here. Pretty much every single drop of oil drilled in the US is sold on the global market, actually. If someone in Asscrackistan is willing to bay 50 cents more a barrel than someone in the US is, the oil company will send it over there, rather than here. So really, it is true, the only thing that will be guaranteed to happen if we open up that oil field is oil company profits go up. Given that they are ALREADY making record profits, I don't really see how that helps us much.

Oh, and you do know that it takes 8-10 YEARS to go from nothing to being able to produce oil, right? Especially in such a remote location, where weather prevents a lot of necessary activities (shipping in things by barge, being able to do proper seismic tests, etc) from happening for most of the year. Also, the field is NOT that large. Best case estimate is about 10 billion barrels. (95% chance it's at least about 6b, 5% chance it's as high as about 15). Prudhoe Bay which is already in operation, for example, is over 13 billion. Also, the various fields in ANWR with oil are small and scattered, the biggest being about 1-1.3b, and most of the rest about 500-700m. So, that means the oil will be more expensive to extract than Prudhoe, as it will require a lot of small, scattered infrastructure, rather than 1 big site.

Anyway, all of those arguments against bothering are completely separate from the environmental concerns, which are large. Oh, and it's not the EPA that is preventing anything up there. ANWR was closed by an act of congress, not by the EPA. The EPA had nothing to do with it. To open it up would require a completely new act of congress to repeal the old law regarding the area.

So yeah, just doesn't seem like a good idea to me. Lots of risks, a decade to do ANYTHING, and even then, the only ones that seem to benefit are the oil companies, who are raking it in hand over fist already. Just doesn't seem to make sense.

-Arlos

PS: Check here: http://www.eia.gov/oiaf/servicerpt/anwr ... ology.html for the official study of ANWR from 2008 under the Bush administration.

[Griever]

If we wanted the oil in Alaska I promise you the "environmental wackos" wouldn't stop our government from getting it. If I had to guess, our government would much rather take oil from outside sources and use the oil in Alaska as a reserve.

[10sun]

All of you overlook the problem of refineries to process this crude oil.

Can't just put oil from the ground into a car and make it go vroom.

[brinstar]

fuck oil, invest in sustainable energy sources and achieve energy independence the RIGHT way.

oh and btw guess what happens when you invest in green energy

jobs created to build and maintain wind turbines, jobs created to build and maintain solar energy arrays, jobs created to build and maintain geothermal plants

jobs created = money made = money spent in economy = end of recession

[Tikker]

need a lot of oil to build solar stuff, wuwu

[Narrock]

fuck oil, invest in sustainable energy sources and achieve energy independence the RIGHT way.

oh and btw guess what happens when you invest in green energy

jobs created to build and maintain wind turbines, jobs created to build and maintain solar energy arrays, jobs created to build and maintain geothermal plants

jobs created = money made = money spent in economy = end of recession

Such as Solyndra? Not being a smartass, but apparently the Chinese can manufacture and slap together solar panels at a fraction of the cost as us. And if you want to talk about wind energy... All I can say about that is I only see about 5% of the turbines spinning whenever I drive through wind turbine areas. Take the windmills on the Altamont Pass inbetween Livermore and Tracy for example... there thousands of them, but I never see more than about 5% of them spinning. And that area is a very windy area. Seems like a huge waste of money.

[Zanchief]

Such as Solyndra?

As much as you guys want to kill Obama for doing anything, he was right and so is Brin. Digging for more oil is still just a costly, temporary solution. Solar technology needs to get better, battery technology needs to get better. These are things that will help a lot.

[Narrock]

How about Hydrogen?

[Zanchief]

How about Hydrogen?

Wasn't that Ws big thing because he invested heavily in it? Even with the backing of the Whitehouse it didn't go anywhere because it was a dead end. Having said that research into any alternative fuel is a good idea in my opinion.

[10sun]

fuck oil, invest in sustainable energy sources and achieve energy independence the RIGHT way.

oh and btw guess what happens when you invest in green energy

jobs created to build and maintain wind turbines, jobs created to build and maintain solar energy arrays, jobs created to build and maintain geothermal plants

jobs created = money made = money spent in economy = end of recession

Such as Solyndra? Not being a smartass, but apparently the Chinese can manufacture and slap together solar panels at a fraction of the cost as us. And if you want to talk about wind energy... All I can say about that is I only see about 5% of the turbines spinning whenever I drive through wind turbine areas. Take the windmills on the Altamont Pass inbetween Livermore and Tracy for example... there thousands of them, but I never see more than about 5% of them spinning. And that area is a very windy area. Seems like a huge waste of money.

Your sample is skewed for wind turbines.

Wind speeds pick up at night and that is when wind turbines generate the majority of their energy; that makes them a good compliment to solar energy.

[leah]

man, there are huge wind farms in eastern colorado that you can see from the interstate when you drive from nebraska to denver. those fuckers are ALWAYS spinning. really cool sight to see.

on an energy-saving note, i wish my workplace would allow us to telecommute. so little of what we do requires any face-to-face interaction!

[Gypsiyee]

I actually get to start telecommuting soon. It won't be every week, but 4 our of my 5 days out of the 9 per pay period that I work will be telework. Super excited.

And the telework is due to our command being all energy conscious. Long term, I'll end up sharing a cube with someone and rotating out so that we maximize workspace.

[Tossica]

I work 4x10 a week, 2 of which are from home. I could do 99.9% of my job from home but they still want an in person presence.

[brinstar]

the Chinese can manufacture and slap together solar panels at a fraction of the cost as us

...because they've been investing heavily in the technology for years. we are woefully behind in the states because - surprise! - Big Oil has too much sway

and dude it gets windy as fuck here hehe

western iowa is jam-packed with wind turbines that are always moving, and there's room for plenty more

[Arlos]

They're also starting to experiment more with wave turbines in a couple water areas with strong currents. The trick, like with wind turbines, is how to keep them from chopping the local marine life into cutlets. From what I remember, they have that mostly solved. Also, the power generation capabilities of wave turbines are higher than wind turbines, as water is much denser than air, so flows of water have more energy to tap than flows of water. A 1.2 Megawatt station is already operational in Scotland. Site surveys have been done in a bunch of places, especially Canada, where they found one of the bays at the end of the Bay of Fundy estuary could generate as much as 3800 Megawatts.

Renewable energy is another area that Germany has gone heavily into. In Germany alone, they have nearly 26 gigawatts of wind turbine power plants already online. The US NEEDS to do more.

-Arlos

[brinstar]

the Chinese can manufacture and slap together solar panels at a fraction of the cost as us

...because they've been investing heavily in the technology for years. we are woefully behind in the states because - surprise! - Big Oil has too much sway

and dude it gets windy as fuck here hehe

western iowa is jam-packed with wind turbines that are always moving, and there's room for plenty more

and as an added afterthought, since when do we not bother with something simply because some other country currently does it better? ever hear of sputnik?

[Yamori]

I'm personally very much for keeping reserves untapped, but not due to environmental reasons. per say (although theyre legitimate)

We need to have large oil reserves for when the rest of the world runs out of it. Even if super efficient electric engines/batteries arrive at some point in the not too distant future, planes and armies will still need fossil fuel to function. Since demand from India and China keeps going up,things are gonna suck hard for the world once we go past peak oil, and the future economic impact of increasingly scarce fuel will be really, really bad. Better to hold back now so we can have a significant safety buffer when that time comes.