Shots fired in to the Al Jazeera offices in Gaza, a day afte

[Drem]

r the Israeli FM said they would work to shut the network down

http://m.aljazeera.com/se/2014722829152765


/u/lopolane:
"it's really Hamas' fault for allowing journalists to fire facts from their territory. So far 2 israelis have been educated, an unacceptable toll"

[brinstar]

isn't shooting at unarmed journalists a war crime?

[Ganzo]

Shots fired into the building, not at journalists. Story conveniently leaves out any mention of what else was going on at the time (were there any Hamas fighters shooting at Israeli soldiers from that building? rockets launched from that building?). Hamas's "Operation Human Shield" is ran around setting up positions in Hospitals, Schools, Mosques, residential buildings and news agencies. Hamas's goal to get as many of their own people killed as possible to cause the propaganda campaign against Israel. Every time idiots pick up these types of stories as a cry about Evil Israel killing civilians, they are playing right into Hamas's hand and encouraging these tactics.

Open your eyes and see whats really going on.

[Harrison]

isn't shooting at unarmed journalists a war crime?

So is blowing civilians up as primary targets, isn't it?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Pa ... de_attacks

That's not even listing mortars, rockets, etc.

It's hard to give two fucks about either side when both sides are wrong.

[brinstar]

dude for sure, violence only begets violence. both sides are fuckin wrong as shit on paper

but first of all, since when does one war crime cancel out another? second, you've got one side with WW1.3-era mortars and the other side with WW3-era tanks and jets and nukes - that, oh yeah, let's not forget, are mostly paid for by american taxpayers like you and me - so pardon me if i find it kinda tough to pretend there's any kind of balance or "wrongness equivalency"

you're a militia type, let me ask you this instead: what would you do if the UN said new york and pennsylvania could be their own nation, so they got together and forced all of the residents of massachusetts and connecticut into what is now rhode island, on top of all the people already living there, then built a maximum security wall isolating you against the atlantic, AND restricted your passage and commerce in and out of the wee little state you're all stacked up in? and THEN every year shoved you further toward the atlantic so they could build more and more apartment complexes for themselves on the land they said you could have? would you throw up your hands and be all like "o man idc if they commit war crimes against us, we can't fight back without committing war crimes ourselves so let's just roll over and get pushed into the sea"? please. your gunboner would be rock hard from day 0. you'd get to live out your dream of urban guerrilla warfare until you ate lead, and in a situation like that you'd gladly hole up in a school if it meant surviving another week

fuckin lol @ zionism. "but teacher, the big bully was only defending himself when he bashed the runty kid's face in for scuffing his shoe after being tormented since kindergarten!" gimme a fuckin break

[Ganzo]

170000 killed in Syria - where is your outrage?
500 civilians killed in Eastern Ukraine by US backed Ukrainian regime - where is your outrage?
500000 dead in Iraq from wars/insurgencies since US invasion - where is your outrage?
600+ sentenced for execution in Egypt in one day - where is your outrage?

I can go on and on and on with this list.

The only time people like Brinstar and Drem speak up is when Israel defends itself from 1000+ rockets raining down on the country over a course of few weeks.
Don't want to be overly dramatic but it is obvious that your concerns are not with human lives and suffering but with Israel.

[brinstar]

don't change the subject. you're defending genocide.

[Ganzo]

don't change the subject. you're defending genocide.

Bullshit, if Israel wanted genocide, it could wipe out Gaza in 5 minutes.

You cant see past your blinders to what is really happening. No country in the world would allow constant bombardment of it's territory and most would respond much harsher than Israel does.

And before you make your list of reasons why Gaza is suffering, try to find one item on that list that was not caused by Hamas.

[brinstar]

the only reason they haven't yet is because not even the USA could stomach that - so they do as much as they can get away with. because let's be clear, none of the bloodshed and terror they inflict daily upon their prisoners would be possible without US backing

but whatever, clearly you have zero interest in rational discussion so in lieu of such i invite you to kindly go fuck yourself

in other news, a UN-operated elementary school in gaza got shelled to bits today, and the blood of innocent children still stain its shattered pavement

self-defence my ass

[brinstar]

PS

170000 killed in Syria - where is your outrage?
500 civilians killed in Eastern Ukraine by US backed Ukrainian regime - where is your outrage?
500000 dead in Iraq from wars/insurgencies since US invasion - where is your outrage?
600+ sentenced for execution in Egypt in one day - where is your outrage?

ask me about these things in different threads on those topics (in which you're not exulting in the extreme violence perpetrated daily by Count Netanyahula and his war machine) and i'll show you my outrage

[Ganzo]

the only reason they haven't yet is because not even the USA could stomach that - so they do as much as they can get away with.

That is your opinion which is backed by nothing other your hate for Israel

but whatever, clearly you have zero interest in rational discussion so in lieu of such i invite you to kindly go fuck yourself

why because i operate in facts and you have nothing to disprove them?

in other news, a UN-operated elementary school in gaza got shelled to bits today, and the blood of innocent children still stain its shattered pavement

self-defence my ass

http://www.unrwa.org/newsroom/press-rel ... ts-schools
Sure because Hamas respects schools and does not use them as human shields

[Ganzo]

PS

170000 killed in Syria - where is your outrage?
500 civilians killed in Eastern Ukraine by US backed Ukrainian regime - where is your outrage?
500000 dead in Iraq from wars/insurgencies since US invasion - where is your outrage?
600+ sentenced for execution in Egypt in one day - where is your outrage?

ask me about these things in different threads on those topics (in which you're not exulting in the extreme violence perpetrated daily by Count Netanyahula and his war machine) and i'll show you my outrage

Find one of them please, only time there are threads about people being killed here is when you and your liberal crew needs to hate on Israel

[brinstar]

i don't hate israel, you idiot

i hate their actions

can you not understand the difference?

there is no peace because israel does not want peace


anyway a) that school was vacant, so your narrative is mostly false. as is most of the hype you're gulping down.

but more importantly b) i didn't start this thread. i also didn't start a thread about the pro-russian separatists in ukraine that shot down MH17 with russian BUK missiles. i also didn't start a thread about hard-rightwing foreign fascist militants infiltrating peaceful anti-government protests which led to independence square in kiev becoming a burning bloodbath. i also didn't start a thread about those cunts down south who spend thousands of dollars to make their penis-compensating trucks less efficient just so they can spew black smoke on other people and hasten the rising of the tides. i also didn't start a thread about hypocrisy of american "christians" trying to send refugee children back to central america to be raped and murdered. i also didn't start a thread about brutalization of fifa protesters in brazil. i also didn't start a thread about ISIS jablowning all of syria and iraq. i'm not gonna start a fucking thread about every single example of humans being fucking horrible to each other, because that's a fucking full time job - but fuck you if you think the absence of a brinstar thread on a topic means the absence of brinstar outrage, that's actually the stupidest thing you've said in this thread

[Ganzo]

but more importantly b) i didn't start this thread. i also didn't start a thread about the pro-russian separatists in ukraine that shot down MH17 with russian BUK missiles. i also didn't start a thread about hard-rightwing foreign fascist militants infiltrating peaceful anti-government protests which led to independence square in kiev becoming a burning bloodbath. i also didn't start a thread about those cunts down south who spend thousands of dollars to make their penis-compensating trucks less efficient just so they can spew black smoke on other people and hasten the rising of the tides. i also didn't start a thread about hypocrisy of american "christians" trying to send refugee children back to central america to be raped and murdered. i also didn't start a thread about brutalization of fifa protesters in brazil. i also didn't start a thread about ISIS jablowning all of syria and iraq. i'm not gonna start a fucking thread about every single example of humans being fucking horrible to each other, because that's a fucking full time job - but fuck you if you think the absence of a brinstar thread on a topic means the absence of brinstar outrage, that's actually the stupidest thing you've said in this thread

yet you find time to always get your 2 cents in about murderous Israelis every time it's mentioned

Like it or not i cant read your mind only your comments, and by your comments you more than simply "hate their actions", you take a stance prior to reviewing facts, as example your reference to UN School in Gaza. UN officials are saying they are not sure if it was Hamas or Israel that hit the school, yet you already blamed it on Israel.

[brinstar]

if independent reviewers come out and say hamas shelled the school and murdered the children inside, i will retract my statement, apologize, and proceed to blame hamas for shelling the school and murdering the children inside

but until such a report surfaces, i'd like you to explain why it is unfair to assume that the war machine currently pounding the fuck out of gaza with gunboats, airstrikes, tanks, and ground troops MIGHT POSSIBLY be responsible for shelling the school and murdering the children inside. please, i'm all ears

that's like me saying "you don't know hamas fired those rockets at israel, maybe it was other israelis" - sure it's not outside the realm of possibility, but it's still a ridiculous argument and one which i would not make without a mountain of evidence

[Ganzo]

if independent reviewers come out and say hamas shelled the school and murdered the children inside, i will retract my statement, apologize, and proceed to blame hamas for shelling the school and murdering the children inside

but until such a report surfaces, i'd like you to explain why it is unfair to assume that the war machine currently pounding the fuck out of gaza with gunboats, airstrikes, tanks, and ground troops MIGHT POSSIBLY be responsible for shelling the school and murdering the children inside. please, i'm all ears

that's like me saying "you don't know hamas fired those rockets at israel, maybe it was other israelis" - sure it's not outside the realm of possibility, but it's still a ridiculous argument and one which i would not make without a mountain of evidence

Two sides are firing at each other, school in the middle - why is it such a stretch to think that the shot could have come from ether side. Especially when local UN sources (not Israelis) are saying they don't know who fired and if it was even a shot or an explosion of ammunition.

Personally I will wait and see what it was before assigning blame.

Regardless, Hamas is shelling Israeli schools daily, but you are not complaining. I guess it's Israel's fault for having defense systems to protect people, they should let Hamas missiles hit targets and let people die so you will understand the situation.

[Jay]

[brinstar]

ganzo, you are completely incapable of being objective on this matter. that's not meant as an insult, because i understand that you care about the safety of your promised land. believe it or not, so do i.

i too am incapable of being objective, only i am biased against bloodshed and brutal oppression regardless of whichever nationality or ethnicity or faith perpetrates it. i speak against the government of israel - not its people, not its faith - because although i do not find hamas to be innocent in the slightest, there is nothing even remotely resembling balance when the atrocities of each side are compared.

until such time as your bias and my bias are no longer directly at odds with each other, we cannot begin to agree on this topic.

[Drem]

Israel lately:

1. We haven't heard reports of deaths, we will check into it

2. The people were killed, but by a faulty Palestinian rocket/bomb

3. Ok we killed them, but they were terrorists

4. Ok they were civilians, but they were being used as human shields

5. Ok there were no fighters in the area, so it was our mistake. But we kill civilians by accident, they do it on purpose

6. Ok we kill far more civilians than they do, but look at how terrible other countries are!

7. Why are you still talking about Israel ? Are you some kind of anti-semite?

[Ganzo]

i speak against the government of israel - not its people, not its faith - because although i do not find hamas to be innocent in the slightest, there is nothing even remotely resembling balance when the atrocities of each side are compared.

Let's skip everything leading up to this conflict because no one can change past. In this specific conflict:
Hamas kidnaps and murders 3 Israeli teenagers, Israeli military searches for them, arrests bunch of other people while they at it and kill few who try to fight them.(Hamas is wrong in killing kids, Israel is wrong in using excessive force.) Palestinians cheer the kidnapping and murder, spaming social media with pictures of 3 finger salute. Couple of Israeli extremists grab a Palestinian teenager and kill him in retaliation, they are quickly arrested.
Palestinians start mass riots, Israeli military stops them, people get hurt.
Hamas starts sending missiles into Israel, Israel retaliates and same thing that was happening in 2012 begins again. As last time Israel has strong defense and blocks majority of missiles so casualties are very much one sided.
Hamas unloads with new weapons they got from Iran during last cease fire and shells entire country of Israel, but majority of missiles are still stopped by Israeli Defenses.
Egypt brokers Cease Fire, Hamas rejects. Hamas sends team through tunnels to kidnap and kill civilians in nearby village but they are stopped.
Israel warns that if Hamas does not stop firing rockets they will go in with ground forces, Hamas ignores.
Israel goes in, since then 2 more cease fire attempts were refused by Hamas.

So now since you claim that Israeli government is evil, how would you stop this war?

This is how Arabs view Hamas now: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7VtENBF_yjo

[Harrison]

you're a militia type, let me ask you this instead: what would you do if the UN said new york and pennsylvania could be their own nation, so they got together and forced all of the residents of massachusetts and connecticut into what is now rhode island, on top of all the people already living there, then built a maximum security wall isolating you against the atlantic, AND restricted your passage and commerce in and out of the wee little state you're all stacked up in? and THEN every year shoved you further toward the atlantic so they could build more and more apartment complexes for themselves on the land they said you could have? would you throw up your hands and be all like "o man idc if they commit war crimes against us, we can't fight back without committing war crimes ourselves so let's just roll over and get pushed into the sea"? please. your gunboner would be rock hard from day 0. you'd get to live out your dream of urban guerrilla warfare until you ate lead, and in a situation like that you'd gladly hole up in a school if it meant surviving another week

your gunboner would be rock hard from day 0. you'd get to live out your dream of urban guerrilla warfare until you ate lead, and in a situation like that you'd gladly hole up in a school if it meant surviving another week

If there was no other option, and it came down to potential death for my family or not, I'd be forced to fight.

In no way, even remotely, would my "gunboner" as you incessantly desire to put it come out rock hard. There are priorities above all else that I wouldn't expect someone without kids to understand. The entire situation is a nightmare I don't wish to see because of those priorities. If there's ever a devastating natural disaster that turns this area into the raping, marauding, pillaging hellhole I know it would become in that event, I'm sure I'll commit some atrocities myself to keep my family alive.

You're confusing my general apathy towards the entire middle east with support for one side over another. I just don't give a flying fuck because they're ALWAYS killing each other. Thousands of years of incessant mass murder over one thing or another.

I wish we would stop sending that entire fucking region even a single penny but, I can't control that. The government is off the rails. It does whatever the fuck it wants now, even when the largest majority of its people says, "fuck off."

So, as usual, eat a salty hairy cock in regards to your anti-gun-vagina issues you can't seem to get over.

[brinstar]

Let's skip everything leading up to this conflict because no one can change past.

yeah that's a great line of reasoning:

why does israel bomb the fuck out of gaza? because hamas fires some rockets.
why does hamas fire rockets? because they hate israel
why does hamas hate israel? NOPE STOP THERE I HAVE ALL THE JUSTIFICATION I NEED, BOMB THEM!

you always stop there dude. you're never willing to think about the policies that created the current situation where a poverty-stricken people are herded and exiled onto a tiny piece of land and locked between the (blockaded!) sea and a maximum-security wall with a 30m "no go" zone and razor-wire checkpoints - and you're never willing to consider policies that might reverse such subjugation and oppression. crazy idea: stop treating people like quarantined lepers for no reason and maybe they'll stop scuffing your apartment buildings with bottle rockets.

you're right, no one can change the past - but if your only answer to the problem is violence, you're never going to change the present or the future.


and

If there's ever a devastating natural disaster that turns this area into the raping, marauding, pillaging hellhole I know it would become in that event, I'm sure I'll commit some atrocities myself to keep my family alive.

that's exactly what i was getting at: you would do the same in that situation.

I wish we would stop sending that entire fucking region even a single penny but, I can't control that. The government is off the rails. It does whatever the fuck it wants now, even when the largest majority of its people says, "fuck off."

this is spot on. we consistently funnel money over there no matter who is in office, and no amount of public outrage is ever enough to pinch it off.

GUNS RAAAR

hehe you're so easy to short-circuit

[Zanchief]

There will be no solutions to the problem when people continue to think they are better than the other side. There is no difference between a Jew and a Muslim, yet Ganzo demonstrates such unmitigating hatred for them. This is the problem and conflict only strengthens those feelings. You can't destroy terrorism with weapons short of genocide because it's an ideology you're fighting, and it just makes things worse.

Ganzo, you say Brinstar has no solution, but what is yours? What is Israeli's end game? What do they think will come of the violence? You hold Israel to a higher standard and so does the world. That's where the criticism comes from. If you're more civilized than show it. Are you morally justified in defending yourself against aggression? Sure. What does it accomplish aside from satiating your own bloodlust?

[Zanchief]

There are priorities above all else that I wouldn't expect someone without kids to understand.

Rule 1 about not being a douche dad. Don't tell people who don't have kids that they don't understand.

[Ganzo]

Let's skip everything leading up to this conflict because no one can change past.

yeah that's a great line of reasoning:

why does israel bomb the fuck out of gaza? because hamas fires some rockets.
why does hamas fire rockets? because they hate israel
why does hamas hate israel? NOPE STOP THERE I HAVE ALL THE JUSTIFICATION I NEED, BOMB THEM!

you always stop there dude. you're never willing to think about the policies that created the current situation where a poverty-stricken people are herded and exiled onto a tiny piece of land and locked between the (blockaded!) sea and a maximum-security wall with a 30m "no go" zone and razor-wire checkpoints - and you're never willing to consider policies that might reverse such subjugation and oppression. crazy idea: stop treating people like quarantined lepers for no reason and maybe they'll stop scuffing your apartment buildings with bottle rockets.

you're right, no one can change the past - but if your only answer to the problem is violence, you're never going to change the present or the future.

So you will ignore everything and reply to first sentence only, great way to counter argument - oh wait you cant, because you cant come up with another solution to current situation, there is no solution to stooping the violence other than eliminating Hamas or in the very least disarming them.

I was gonna write up a whole essay on the history of this conflict but you are not gonna read it, so why bother.