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Lyion wrote:The pope isn't an idol, he's the head of the Church Peter started. You know, the guy Jesus said to: "You are Peter, and on this rock I will build my Church" in Matthew 16:18.

Kizzy wrote:AS I said, not trying to start a religious debate here but if people bow down to him and pray to him, in my book that makes him a religious idol.

Diabolik wrote:Everyone knows there's only one Idol.

<img src="http://www.legendheart.com/billy_idol.jpg">

Tuggan wrote:I was raised Catholic, and even though I consider myself a staunch athiest nowadays... it fucking pisses me off when people mouth off about the Catholic religion and the church.

While the pope and I dont see eye to eye on many issues, I have a ton of respect for the man. He did a great deal of good during his time.


Fuck you Mindia, you have absolutely no concept of christianity.

Ugzugz wrote:I'm not getting into this SAME ARGUMENT with you again Mindia... suffice to say, you're still wrong.

Mindia wrote:... confessing your sins to a guy in a booth who is acting as an intercessory between you and God (when the Bible clearly says to confess your sins with your mouth to God, not another man). ...

... The Bible says you cannot worship two leaders. You pray to Jesus, and Jesus alone. I have seen people kneel down, kissing the feet of the pope while tears stream from their eyes. That is worship, and that is just wrong. The Pope is just a man.

Confession


Are all of our sins—past, present, and future—forgiven once and for all when we become Christians? Not according to the Bible or the early Church Fathers. Scripture nowhere states that our future sins are forgiven; instead, it teaches us to pray, "And forgive us our debts, as we also have forgiven our debtors" (Matt. 6:12).

The means by which God forgives sins after baptism is confession: "If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just, and will forgive our sins and cleanse us from all unrighteousness" (1 John 1:9). Minor or venial sins can be confessed directly to God, but for grave or mortal sins, which crush the spiritual life out of the soul, God has instituted a different means for obtaining forgiveness—the sacrament known popularly as confession, penance, or reconciliation.

This sacrament is rooted in the mission God gave to Christ in his capacity as the Son of man on earth to go and forgive sins (cf. Matt. 9:6). Thus, the crowds who witnessed this new power "glorified God, who had given such authority to men" (Matt. 9:8; note the plural "men"). After his resurrection, Jesus passed on his mission to forgive sins to his ministers, telling them, "As the Father has sent me, even so I send you. . . . Receive the Holy Spirit. If you forgive the sins of any, they are forgiven; if you retain the sins of any, they are retained" (John 20:21–23).

Since it is not possible to confess all of our many daily faults, we know that sacramental reconciliation is required only for grave or mortal sins—but it is required, or Christ would not have commanded it.

Over time, the forms in which the sacrament has been administered have changed. In the early Church, publicly known sins (such as apostasy) were often confessed openly in church, though private confession to a priest was always an option for privately committed sins. Still, confession was not just something done in silence to God alone, but something done "in church," as the Didache (A.D. 70) indicates.

Penances also tended to be performed before rather than after absolution, and they were much more strict than those of today (ten years’ penance for abortion, for example, was common in the early Church).

But the basics of the sacrament have always been there, as the following quotations reveal. Of special significance is their recognition that confession and absolution must be received by a sinner before receiving Holy Communion, for "[w]hoever . . . eats the bread or drinks the cup of the Lord in an unworthy manner will be guilty of profaning the body and blood of the Lord" (1 Cor. 11:27).

Since it is not possible to confess all of our many daily faults, we know that sacramental reconciliation is required only for grave or mortal sins—but it is required, or Christ would not have commanded it.

Over time, the forms in which the sacrament has been administered have changed. In the early Church, publicly known sins (such as apostasy) were often confessed openly in church, though private confession to a priest was always an option for privately committed sins. Still, confession was not just something done in silence to God alone, but something done "in church," as the Didache (A.D. 70) indicates.