Bluray still wtfpwning HDDVD

[Lyion]

http://www.engadgethd.com/2007/11/09/ni ... -november/



Toshiba needs to throw a few hundred million more around, methinks.

[Ginzburgh]

I hope Blue Ray wins for the sole fact that it would prove Tossica wrong.

[Ouchyfish]

Your results MUST be biased or some other crazy shit.

[Harrison]

I hope Blue Ray wins for the sole fact that it would prove Tossica wrong.

[Tossica]

Your results MUST be biased or some other crazy shit.

I don't know if bias is the right word but considering Walmart and several other retailers don't share their numbers with the Nielsen's, it's a little hard to take any of their statistics at face value. Walmart owns approx 40% of the DVD market.






In other news, Sony is not so confident they have "won" the war anymore.

asfd

NEW YORK (AP) — The head of Sony Corp., Howard Stringer, said Thursday that the Blu-ray disc format the company has developed as the successor to the DVD is in a "stalemate" with the competing HD DVD format, chiefly backed by Toshiba Corp. and Microsoft Corp.

"It's a difficult fight," said Stringer, speaking at the 92nd Street Y cultural center in Manhattan.

Toshiba has been selling its players for as low as $200 heading into the holiday season, while Blu-ray players cost more than twice as much. The HD DVD camp also scored a significant win in August, when it induced Paramount Pictures to drop most of its support for Blu-ray and put out high-definition movies exclusively on HD DVD.

"We were trying to win on the merits, which we were doing for a while, until Paramount changed sides," Stringer said.

At the same time, he played down the importance of the battle, saying it was mostly a matter of prestige whose format wins out in the end.

"It doesn't mean as much as all that," Stringer said. He added that he believed there was an opportunity of uniting the two camps under one format before he became CEO, and he wishes he could travel back in time to make that happen.

Stringer was more upbeat about the PlayStation 3, the game console that has so far had disappointing sales compared to the rival Nintendo Wii.

The CEO said the console is the best-selling console in Europe after a price cut three weeks ago. In the U.S., a recent price cut has doubled sales.

"We are coming back up again," Stringer said. The company aims to sell 10 million PS3s by the end of its fiscal year in March. Nintendo has already sold 13.2 million Wiis.

[Tossica]

Not sure why this needed it's own thread... seems like it could have been posted in the existing one.

[Ginzburgh]

If it's a "stalemate" someone should just propose and merger so we can be done with this shit and move on.

[Tossica]

If it's a "stalemate" someone should just propose and merger so we can be done with this shit and move on.

It's already done. The PS3 owners will still be able to watch Blu-Ray movies and everyone else will use HD-DVD.

[Ginzburgh]

Did I miss something? No other manufacturers are making blue ray players anymore? HD-DVD "wins"?

[Tossica]

Did I miss something? No other manufacturers are making blue ray players anymore? HD-DVD "wins"?

Plenty of other manufacturers have made them but many new models are being cancelled because noone is buying them. The PS3 is the only BR player that is selling.

[Lyion]

There are plenty of Blu-ray manufacturers. Currently, only Toshiba makes HD-DVD players.

Some companies are looking into Dual Format players, also.

A majority of the high def content is on Blu-ray, which is a good reason why they sell more than twice as many disc's as HD DVD.

Blu-ray is the better technology and it'd be nice if it won.

[Tossica]

There are plenty of Blu-ray manufacturers. Currently, only Toshiba makes HD-DVD players.

Some companies are looking into Dual Format players, also.

A majority of the high def content is on Blu-ray, which is a good reason why they sell more than twice as many disc's as HD DVD.

Blu-ray is the better technology and it'd be nice if it won.

You are so chockful of misinformation. Seriously Lyion, every time you try to post "facts" you end up owning yourself.

Toshiba, Onkyo, RCA and a few other "in store" CE manufacturers are making HD-DVD players. Expect more companies to release players next year.

The number of titles available for each format has been neck and neck since shortly after the formats were launched. I think there are like 6 more BR titles available right now than HD-DVD but that usually flip flops on a weekly basis. They don't sell "over twice as many" disc's as HD-DVD except on rare occasions. The real ratio is closer to 1.5-1 which isn't all that great considering the 6-1 hardware ratio they enjoy.

BR's advantages are not worth the extra money the format costs. While "slightly" better according to spec, the real world benefits just aren't there for movies considering the extra cost.

As long as Sony keeps claiming they've won and misinformed people like Lyion keep believing the bullshit, BR might have a chance of becoming something other than a niche market but unless they seriously drop their prices, the chances of the format reaching mass market penetration are slim to none.

[Ginzburgh]

err...seems like this takes the misinformation cake of the day...

It's already done. The PS3 owners will still be able to watch Blu-Ray movies and everyone else will use HD-DVD.

[Tossica]

err...seems like this takes the misinformation cake of the day...

It's already done. The PS3 owners will still be able to watch Blu-Ray movies and everyone else will use HD-DVD.

That's my opinion. It was never stated as fact.

[Ginzburgh]

Seemed like you stated it as fact to me. Typically, when someone gives their opinion, it is usually followed by, "in my opinion" or "i think that"...

And to be honest, I really don't care who wins. I just want this to be over so I can start buying high definition movies.

[Ouchyfish]

I'm surprised the region free hasnt seen more publicity.

[Tossica]

I just want this to be over so I can start buying high definition movies.

Good luck on that. It took Beta about 6 years before it died completely. Laserdisc hung around for 10+ years, etc

I wanted high definition movies as well however I was not willing to pay $600+ to watch them so I chose HD-DVD. The quality is nearly identical and in many cases HD-DVD is BETTER no matter what bullshit Sony and other BR fanboys try to tell you. Watch the same movie, side by side, on identical BR and HD-DVD systems and then tell me the BR version is worth $300 more. If you say it is, you are fooling yourself, seriously. With the sub $200 players hitting the market in waves, it's ridiculous at this point for fans of HD media to "sit and wait". There is not ever going to be a clear winner until people actually buy in and start spending money on their chosen format.

Wait for the next Walmart HD-A2 $99 blowout or pick up an HD-A3 at Sears on Black Friday with 7 free movies for $169. You won't regret it.

[Ouchyfish]

Amazing how often you motherfuckers on this board flaunt how "rich" you are and how you spare no expense on your toys but let some fanboyism get in there and all of a sudden 300 dollars is a fucking obstacle....

give me a fucking break.

[Tossica]

I'd wager that $300 is a lot of money to just about anyone posting in this thread or on this board even. I'm not sure just what the fuck you are talking about.

[Lyion]

Someone spending a lot of dough on a pimped out HD home theater system isn't going to sweat a few hundred dollar player difference. Especially when the HD cheapie model doesn't do 1080p (upscaling not withstanding), lacks features, and lacks most of the better movies that are Blu-ray exclusive.

People are slowly moving into the HD market. As that picks up, and as the cheap ass POS A2s run out on ebay over the next six months, people will continue to buy PS3s and Blu-ray players and the better Blu-ray content.

18 months from now when the Paramount exclusive is done, then Blu-ray will deliver the death blow to HD-DVD.

Also, there are no more 99 dollar HD players. The cheaper ones are now around 200 bucks. Why spend 200 bucks for a Piece of crap HD DVD player when you can spend 399 for a PS3 gaming system?

[Tossica]

Someone spending a lot of dough on a pimped out HD home theater system isn't going to sweat a few hundred dollar player difference. Especially when the HD cheapie model doesn't do 1080p (upscaling not withstanding), lacks features, and lacks most of the better movies that are Blu-ray exclusive.

People are slowly moving into the HD market. As that picks up, and as the cheap ass POS A2s run out on ebay over the next six months, people will continue to buy PS3s and Blu-ray players and the better Blu-ray content.

18 months from now when the Paramount exclusive is done, then Blu-ray will deliver the death blow to HD-DVD.

Also, there are no more 99 dollar HD players. The cheaper ones are now around 200 bucks. Why spend 200 bucks for a Piece of crap HD DVD player when you can spend 399 for a PS3 gaming system?

People spending a lot of dough on a pimped out home theater system are not the ones that decide which format lives and which one dies. It's people spending < $1000 on their HDTV that will decide it as that's what a VAST majority of the public will have when it's time to buy their first HD player.

The 1080i is only an issue because Sony hype bullshit made it so. 1080i is FULL RESOLUTION HD. There is no loss of data having your TV deinterlace it for a second time. It's the SAME PICTURE regardless of whether the content is deinterlaced before it's sent out the player or if it's done by your TV before it's displayed. Do some research on the subject and report back about how much better a 1080p movie signal than a 1080i signal looks on your 1080p display. The answer is none, none better! It 's the SAME content.

Check out the specs on the entry level HD-A2 and then look at Sony's entry level player and tell me which one lacks features? Blu-Ray in general is about 2 years behind HD-DVD on actual "features" and it's doubtful it will EVER "feature" the same amount of interactivity, number of supported codecs, region free operation, etc that HD-DVD has had since DAY ONE since the final spec for BR is STILL NOT implemented.

The content itself is totally subjective. Most of my favorite movies are either dual format or HD exclusives with VERY few BR only titles that I could not import if I really wanted them so BR loses with me.

$99 is the new price entry point. Toshiba has set expectations and I think we'll see it at least 1 more time this holiday season both on the A2 and possibly the 360 add on. The A3 will drop to $149 by next spring, the $99 price point will be filled by "store brands" like Venturer for Target and whichever one Walmart sells as their store brand and the higher end players for the HT enthusiasts will come from Toshiba, the Onkyo and Integra brands and whoever else signs on next year to cash in.

People will buy the $200 HD-DVD player because they don't want a fucking game console to play their movies on or don't even realize the PS3 plays HD movies. The fact that it's TWICE as much also plays a large part in their decision as that $200 could buy them a nice starter collection of movies to go along with the 7 free they got with their players.

[Lyion]

Show me where one can buy a new 99 dollar HD DVD player, please. Here's Wal Marts prices:

http://www.walmart.com/search/browse-ng ... avId=62055

What, the HD player is only 150 less than a PS3? Wow, much smarter for people to get that PS3. And they will.
Oh, the GOOD A2 that doesn't rely on super expensive TVs that you say people don't have costs 600 bucks. Doh!

That $99 was a deal at Wal Mart because none of the HD players were moving and with the PS3s widening the gap Toshiba had to do something. That was desperation at a HUGE loss. That deal is long gone. I'm sure there will be HD and Bluray Black Friday deals. I'm also sure PS3s will outsell HD DVD players by a HUGE margin, and unbalance the margin even more.

The 1080i is an issue. I have a great technical link in regards to that, I'll post tomorrow.

Plus you again ignored that MOST of the movies out in HD, are out in Bluray and not HD DVD. Content will win this war.

[Tossica]

Show me where one can buy a new 99 dollar HD DVD player, please. Here's Wal Marts prices:

http://www.walmart.com/search/browse-ng ... avId=62055

What, the HD player is only 150 less than a PS3? Wow, much smarter for people to get that PS3. And they will.
Oh, the GOOD A2 that doesn't rely on super expensive TVs that you say people don't have costs 600 bucks. Doh!

That $99 was a deal at Wal Mart because none of the HD players were moving and with the PS3s widening the gap Toshiba had to do something. That was desperation at a HUGE loss. That deal is long gone. I'm sure there will be HD and Bluray Black Friday deals. I'm also sure PS3s will outsell HD DVD players by a HUGE margin, and unbalance the margin even more.

The 1080i is an issue. I have a great technical link in regards to that, I'll post tomorrow.

Plus you again ignored that MOST of the movies out in HD, are out in Bluray and not HD DVD. Content will win this war.

I said we'd see the $99 price point again before xmas. It will be the entry level point in the spring.

The people buying the PS3 are buying it because they want to play games on it. This has been proven over and over again.

You obviously still don't understand how the process works so it's best you post your "technical link". Unless you have a TV that supports multiples of 24hz for a refresh (very few do) than the 1080i/p thing is a non issue since the 24fps movie is being pulled off the disc at 1080i/60fps. If your TV supports 24hz or multiples of, then yes, you are better off with the more expensive HD-DVD players that can pull data off the disc at it's native 24fps and display it in 1080p.

As of Oct 1st, HD-DVD had 304 titles available to Blu-Rays 287. HD-DVD appears to have MOST of the content at this point.

[Lyion]

First, people with PS3s are renting and watching Blu-Ray movies. This has been repeated and shown over and over and you ignore it like every other point. You are completely full of shit about this, and have been in this entire thread, and called out on it.

Second, Toshiba is taking a HUGE loss even selling its archived first version HD player at 99 bucks. You may call it big business, but it's losing money to trickle out a few players. Guessing the price penetration in the future doesn't mean shit. Show me facts. This entire thread you keep saying others do not know what they are talking about, and keep proclaiming HD DVD 'winner' which is sillier than fuck to anyone with a REAL clue about this situation, in that the format war has just started and HD is still only a trickle in the home DVD market.

In regards to content anyone here can go to ANY store, Target, Wal Mart, etc and see DOUBLE the Blu-Ray discs on the shelves compared to HD DVDs. This again is FACT and not pulling things out of ones ass.

There won't be a format war for a while because MOST people are not moving to HD for movies due to the cost and lack of desire. Fanbois without sales knowledge screaming about HD DVD victory when they are being crushed in sales, and while both formats are dink compared to actual DVD sales should not be taken serious.

p.s. HD DVD sucks ass.

[Reynaldo]

I'd be willing to bet a good amount of the people buying those black friday players aren't even concerned about watching movies and are either 1) giving them away as Christmas presents or 2) trying to turn a quick buck on eBay.