Long dev post on warriors

Post by **Arlos** » Sun Jan 30, 2005 2:14 pm

http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/threa ... ost1113427

-Arlos

PS, does this count as posting an article?

Zanchief · Post by **Zanchief** » Sun Jan 30, 2005 3:06 pm

I read a post somewhere were Tigole said that Warriors didnt have any issues AT ALL.

I don't know why I would listen to anything he has to say about this game anymore.

Tikker · Post by **Tikker** » Sun Jan 30, 2005 3:11 pm

Basically he's saying if you have issues, you probably suck

Zanchief · Post by **Zanchief** » Sun Jan 30, 2005 3:16 pm

No, he said warriors are one of the strongest classes.

That is a joke.

I have 0 problems in PVE because I have a protection build. This means my solo/PVP effectiveness is considerably worse then ARMS/FURY Warriors.

I deal with it and rarely comment, but when someone on the dev team says that Warriors are one of the strongest classes I wonder about their sanity.

Post by **DangerPaul** » Sun Jan 30, 2005 3:26 pm

Warriors were ownage... they were so awesome they made me realize I was too good to play WoW and quit

Post by **Lyion** » Sun Jan 30, 2005 3:53 pm

Arlos wrote:
PS, does this count as posting an article?

There is nothing wrong with posting articles. The problem is when someone just spends the day cross posting links to other things, and doesn't actually bring anything relevant.

Langston · Post by **Langston** » Sun Jan 30, 2005 4:27 pm

I'm still learning how to play a warrior well... anyone can hit attack and spam heroic strike - that's not a good warrior. I've found that my skills as a warrior are significantly weakened by soloing so much. I spent a fair amount of time last night in SM tanking for a short group (priest, rogue, and myself). We did pretty well - and my knowledge of the class grew tremendously over the evening.

I think what the Blizzard guy said was this:

1) There are some issues/bugs currently affecting the class. Things like Execute misses eating all of the rage, Bloodrage hp/rage return, etc. He commited that these would be addressed.
2) The "auto-attack and afk" warriors are not a benchmark. Meaning, there is a lot to the class if you invest the energy to learn to play it.
3) Warriors are intended to be the best tank. Not the best DPS. Not the highest survivable class.

I agree with most of what he said... although I admit I have a lot to learn about the class yet... but what I'm starting to discover is showing that he's seemingly pretty much right on target.

Post by **Lyion** » Sun Jan 30, 2005 4:50 pm

My main concern would be how are warriors at 60 and can they perform well in a team environment.

That long post did not tell me this and merely pointed out that Blizz feels warriors are balanced.

I do not like the rage system and I'm hoping Blizz fixes it so warriors aren't so limited with what they can do.

Langston · Post by **Langston** » Sun Jan 30, 2005 4:53 pm

I rarely have issues with having enough rage to perform my duties... will this change as I continue to close the gap on 60? Maybe... but it's rarely an issue now, and I only can assume that I learn more and become MORE capable later in the game.

Zanchief · Post by **Zanchief** » Sun Jan 30, 2005 4:58 pm

Lyion wrote:My main concern would be how are warriors at 60 and can they perform well in a team environment.

Warriors are perfect in team/high end raid grouping.

My only issue is Solo, which I dont really do anymore, and PVP.

If the devs, like Tigole, think that Warriors solo anywhere near any other class, they are kidding themselves.

Post by **Lyion** » Sun Jan 30, 2005 5:04 pm

Yeah, thats why I quit playing my Warrior. I was 1h/shield specced and pickup groups were so asstastic.

Meanwhile the people I knew playing Hunters and Paladins were levelling at literally five times the speed I was.

If they are perfect at the endgame, I think they are ok. Levelling in WOW is fairly fast, even for a warrior. It is sucky that its not better balanced, but what can they do to equalize things and not make them overpowered?

Post by **DangerPaul** » Sun Jan 30, 2005 5:14 pm

I would sit and watch Bilge, aka Pacemaker, aka Tim the fuck, soloing elites 2-4 levels higher as I would get owned if I got a single add with mobs equal to +1 higher than me. I kept being told to respec, but fuck that, then it would have broke me for instance runs, where I was an aggro locking mother fucker. Thank god my health forced me to quit, because as EQ showed, I didn't have the control to make myself quit, I just became a mean bitter fuckhead, and continued to play even though I hated it.

Tacks · Post by **Tacks** » Mon Jan 31, 2005 8:14 am

Warriors are perfect unless the person playing it is a fucktard.

The warriors in our guild have no problem doing their job. This is really my brother's first MMORPG he's 14 years old and has a level 60 warrior in our guild now...if he can do Blackrock Spire as main tank then anyone can.

Harrison · Post by **Harrison** » Mon Jan 31, 2005 9:06 am

My brother's warrior does fine too. But in the pvp sense they are worthless, 100%.

vonkaar · Post by **vonkaar** » Mon Jan 31, 2005 9:38 am

PVP doesn't always have to mean 1on1. I wish people would stop seeing it like this. Warriors are great in PVP - in the same sense that they are great PVE. They require support.

Sure, I can take almost anyone 1on1. I'm built for that. I'll probably never respec out of shadow simply because I enjoy 1on1 PVP so much. Warriors don't have this choice. They'll always need someone to heal them... in PVP, PVE or anything else. Get used to it.

Harrison · Post by **Harrison** » Mon Jan 31, 2005 9:44 am

So you're perfectly fine with every other class having a viable chance SOLO in PVP generally, BUT the warrior?

vonkaar · Post by **vonkaar** » Mon Jan 31, 2005 10:09 am

If you think that every other class is perfectly balanced, you need to flag PVP more than once every other week.

Skrum · Post by **Skrum** » Mon Jan 31, 2005 10:35 am

Warriors can maul mages and warlocks if they get on top of them before they die. Mogrim stunned me like 5 times and kicked my ass last time we fought.

Post by **Lyion** » Mon Jan 31, 2005 10:42 am

Skrum wrote:Warriors can maul mages and warlocks if they get on top of them before they die. Mogrim stunned me like 5 times and kicked my ass last time we fought.

Its a matter of luck of the draw. Usually I can beat Warriors at my level, but some have insane weaps and a few good resists screw me. 3+ levels and its not worth it.

At 60 based on my template, the only classes I think can beat me consistently straight up are Shamen and Priests. Rogues are iffy. Warlocks, Hunters, Druids, etc are a good matchup for a smart mage.

Post by **DangerPaul** » Mon Jan 31, 2005 10:51 am

I could destroy most people on my warrior and a couple times came close to getting Vonk and Taxx, who are both incredible at PvP. Its moreso knowledge of your class that makes you good, versus just the class itself.

Tacks · Post by **Tacks** » Mon Jan 31, 2005 11:33 am

Warriors are great for pvp especially Tauren warriors. When a few people go raiding a small town what do you think the alliance is going to focus on...the big hulking Tauren with a huge sword or the troll rogue. They're going to see the big fat tauren first . They certainly aren't the best pvp class but they can do very well if the person knows how to pvp. Equipment makes a huge difference. I think i've seriously beaten my brother 95 out of 100 duels. Now that he has a badass 54DPS weapon and 6,000+ AC armor it's getting very hard to kill him. I was able to beat him with 2000+ hit points left last week and this week since he's upgraded it's a lot closer.

Every class has a weak point and sometimes the players cry nerf before actually learning about the other classes. You'd be amazed at how many warriors don't know that Rend will cancel out a rogues stealth because of the dot effect yet they're probably the ones whining about getting owned.

Every class is viable in pvp, just in different ways.

Lacan · Post by **Lacan** » Mon Jan 31, 2005 12:56 pm

Another thing on warriors and the solo situation: Yes I've watched rogues tear though mob after mob solo and take down even level elites with little issue. As a Shadow Priest I can't even come close to matching this. Warriors don't have it as bad as they think. I pretty much deal with the same situation as described by warriors of only being able to take one mob at a time. If I get an add during the fight I usually have to fear off the second one and kite around for a bit for a few ticks from Spirit Tap or just take off running and hope it doesn't kill me.

As for elites, those are out of the question. I hardly have enough MP (in shadowform with 3800 MP at level 40) to take on an elite 4 levels below me. I just don't have enough MP to knock out the amount of HP they have. I'm sure mages face the same situation as well.

I've found the warriors that complain they are horrible at solo PVE are the same ones I see trying to chain kill mobs 2-3 levels above them and refuse to use food or bandages to decrease their downtime. They just need to learn to adapt and realize that all classes are not built equally. As a priest I've learned to deal with our solo limitations (and by limitations I mean compared to other classes). I have 4 days played on my character and I am level 40. The solution that I came up with was to chain kill mobs 1-2 levels below me and to keep a high supply of drinks to use every few kills. I wouldn't be surprised if a similar strategy would work for warriors as the damage dealt to damage taken ratio would be much more efficient when dealing with mobs low level than you.

As for PVP, I can't really comment much as I have little experience and really haven't seen warriors much in a PVP situation. But from what I understand warriors are great in group PVP. Priests are the other way around. We're pretty much king of 1vs1 PVP however put us in a group situation and we are pretty much the first to go down with little counter to prevent it from happening. Can't have it all I guess.

10sun · Post by **10sun** » Mon Jan 31, 2005 1:22 pm

Spider belt or ornate mithril boots = <3 vs Mages and druids.

Charge, hamstring, click antiroot item, switch to berserker, pummel, do that one dash attack in berserker stance if I get frosted, keep that rythym going.

It is all about being able to macro unfortunately =\

-Adam

Tacks · Post by **Tacks** » Mon Jan 31, 2005 1:35 pm

Or you could just buy free action potions and not worry about being rooted for the next 30 seconds.

10sun · Post by **10sun** » Mon Jan 31, 2005 2:14 pm

belt is infinite clickies near instant recast. Potions = 2 minute timer.

I choose belt.

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Long dev post on warriors

Long dev post on warriors

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